Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick

B_Dub_Saint · 02-19-2013, 06:48 PM

How in the hell is Patrick cut before p.rod?

Seer1 · 02-19-2013, 06:53 PM

Originally Posted by B_Dub_Saint

How in the hell is Patrick cut before p.rod?

Hahaha! Because he sucked worse?

Danno · 02-19-2013, 06:55 PM

Originally Posted by B_Dub_Saint

How in the hell is Patrick cut before p.rod?

Patrick Robinson isn't a bad CB and has huge upside.

burningmetal · 02-20-2013, 06:58 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

Patrick Robinson isn't a bad CB and has huge upside.

Could you elaborate on this?

Danno · 02-20-2013, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

Could you elaborate on this?

Yes, in his 2nd year under GW he started improving quite a bit. It looked like he was progressing nicely. He even looked to be passing Greer as our best CB. Then came Spags.

Patrick Robinson has all the tools to be a solid CB in this league. Under the right coachiong he may turn out very well. Johnny Patrick... not so much.

burningmetal · 02-20-2013, 08:52 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

Yes, in his 2nd year under GW he started improving quite a bit. It looked like he was progressing nicely. He even looked to be passing Greer as our best CB. Then came Spags.

Patrick Robinson has all the tools to be a solid CB in this league. Under the right coachiong he may turn out very well. Johnny Patrick... not so much.

Ok, well... That is how some saw him going into the season. I, for one, never saw much improvement. He showed flashes, but that was it.

The assumption you're making (and let me say that I hope you're right), is that he struggled this year because of a new system. I don't think that was it. The real adjustment fell on the front seven. Robinson, if he WERE a good corner, should have been able to keep up with receivers. His only real strength is his speed. Yet they were blowing by him, left and right, because his instincts are horrible.

Instincts are the hallmark of any good player, regardless of talent level.

Here's the other reason I believe to be part of his struggles. His second year was his first significant action, and I think opposing coaches were able to use that film to really dissect his weaknesses. I can see where a new scheme would affect him to a degree, but he was plain awful. The difference of zone or man coverage is not so great that a good player couldn't at least perform admirably.

I'm all for talking about upside, but at some point you gotta deliver. Calling him a good corner is what raised my eyebrow. Potential does not equal quality. It merely presents the possibility.

Danno · 02-20-2013, 09:04 AM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

...
I'm all for talking about upside, but at some point you gotta deliver. Calling him a good corner is what raised my eyebrow. Potential does not equal quality. It merely presents the possibility.

Who called him a good corner?

burningmetal · 02-20-2013, 09:08 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

Who called him a good corner?

Excuse me, you said he wasn't a BAD corner. My mistake. But it still raises an eyebrow. He was absolutely HORRIFIC last year. As were other members of the secondary, but with the exception of Jenkins, none of them came here with the expectations of P-Rob. He just seems like a colossal waist of talent.

FinSaint · 02-20-2013, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Danno

Yes, in his 2nd year under GW he started improving quite a bit. It looked like he was progressing nicely. He even looked to be passing Greer as our best CB. Then came Spags.

Patrick Robinson has all the tools to be a solid CB in this league. Under the right coachiong he may turn out very well. Johnny Patrick... not so much.

I agree completely with Danno on this. During his 2nd year there was a noticeable improvement in how Robinson played, and that is definitely what you are looking in a 2nd year player. Robinson is clearly better suited for man coverage than zone, because he isn't physical enough to re-route receivers from the LOS, but he has great athleticism to blanket receivers down the field. I would be ready to place a monetary bet on the fact that Robinson's performances will improve quite a lot just by the Saints' backfield reverting back to a man coverage scheme, but I also think that he has taken a lot out of this past season's problems and will improve both mentally and physically for the coming season.

dizzle88 · 02-20-2013, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by FinSaint

I agree completely with Danno on this. During his 2nd year there was a noticeable improvement in how Robinson played, and that is definitely what you are looking in a 2nd year player. Robinson is clearly better suited for man coverage than zone, because he isn't physical enough to re-route receivers from the LOS, but he has great athleticism to blanket receivers down the field. I would be ready to place a monetary bet on the fact that Robinson's performances will improve quite a lot just by the Saints' backfield reverting back to a man coverage scheme, but I also think that he has taken a lot out of this past season's problems and will improve both mentally and physically for the coming season.

In my opinion, I'm still not comfortable with him even in man coverage and he doesn't do a great job of "Blanketing Receivers" downfield, just look at what Dez Bryant did to him when we played dallas and Pat robinson was in man coverage both times
He made Pat Robinson look like a high school player trying to keep up with an NFL receiver
And not just once, he beat Robinson twice for 54 yards and a TD each time

02-19-2013, 06:48 PM	#1
B_Dub_Saint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lafayette, LA Posts: 2,345 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick How in the hell is Patrick cut before p.rod?

02-19-2013, 06:53 PM	#2
Seer1 Site Donor Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Bayou Bayfield CO Posts: 4,722	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by B_Dub_Saint How in the hell is Patrick cut before p.rod? Hahaha! Because he sucked worse?

02-19-2013, 06:55 PM	#3
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,757	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by B_Dub_Saint How in the hell is Patrick cut before p.rod? Patrick Robinson isn't a bad CB and has huge upside.

02-20-2013, 06:58 AM	#4
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by Danno Patrick Robinson isn't a bad CB and has huge upside. Could you elaborate on this?

02-20-2013, 08:14 AM	#5
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,757	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by burningmetal Could you elaborate on this? Yes, in his 2nd year under GW he started improving quite a bit. It looked like he was progressing nicely. He even looked to be passing Greer as our best CB. Then came Spags. Patrick Robinson has all the tools to be a solid CB in this league. Under the right coachiong he may turn out very well. Johnny Patrick... not so much. FinSaint likes this.

02-20-2013, 08:52 AM	#6
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by Danno Yes, in his 2nd year under GW he started improving quite a bit. It looked like he was progressing nicely. He even looked to be passing Greer as our best CB. Then came Spags. Patrick Robinson has all the tools to be a solid CB in this league. Under the right coachiong he may turn out very well. Johnny Patrick... not so much. Ok, well... That is how some saw him going into the season. I, for one, never saw much improvement. He showed flashes, but that was it. The assumption you're making (and let me say that I hope you're right), is that he struggled this year because of a new system. I don't think that was it. The real adjustment fell on the front seven. Robinson, if he WERE a good corner, should have been able to keep up with receivers. His only real strength is his speed. Yet they were blowing by him, left and right, because his instincts are horrible. Instincts are the hallmark of any good player, regardless of talent level. Here's the other reason I believe to be part of his struggles. His second year was his first significant action, and I think opposing coaches were able to use that film to really dissect his weaknesses. I can see where a new scheme would affect him to a degree, but he was plain awful. The difference of zone or man coverage is not so great that a good player couldn't at least perform admirably. I'm all for talking about upside, but at some point you gotta deliver. Calling him a good corner is what raised my eyebrow. Potential does not equal quality. It merely presents the possibility. dizzle88 and K Major like this.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

02-20-2013, 09:04 AM	#7
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,757	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by burningmetal ... I'm all for talking about upside, but at some point you gotta deliver. Calling him a good corner is what raised my eyebrow. Potential does not equal quality. It merely presents the possibility. Who called him a good corner?

02-20-2013, 09:08 AM	#8
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by Danno Who called him a good corner? Excuse me, you said he wasn't a BAD corner. My mistake. But it still raises an eyebrow. He was absolutely HORRIFIC last year. As were other members of the secondary, but with the exception of Jenkins, none of them came here with the expectations of P-Rob. He just seems like a colossal waist of talent.

02-20-2013, 12:03 PM	#9
FinSaint Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Finland... formerly Southern Virginia Posts: 4,963	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by Danno Yes, in his 2nd year under GW he started improving quite a bit. It looked like he was progressing nicely. He even looked to be passing Greer as our best CB. Then came Spags. Patrick Robinson has all the tools to be a solid CB in this league. Under the right coachiong he may turn out very well. Johnny Patrick... not so much. I agree completely with Danno on this. During his 2nd year there was a noticeable improvement in how Robinson played, and that is definitely what you are looking in a 2nd year player. Robinson is clearly better suited for man coverage than zone, because he isn't physical enough to re-route receivers from the LOS, but he has great athleticism to blanket receivers down the field. I would be ready to place a monetary bet on the fact that Robinson's performances will improve quite a lot just by the Saints' backfield reverting back to a man coverage scheme, but I also think that he has taken a lot out of this past season's problems and will improve both mentally and physically for the coming season.
	"I'm not bashing people, I'm bashing their opinions because in my opinion their opinion is wrong" - Danno

02-20-2013, 12:09 PM	#10
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,534	Re: Holder: Saints Cut Dave Thomas, Johnny Patrick Originally Posted by FinSaint I agree completely with Danno on this. During his 2nd year there was a noticeable improvement in how Robinson played, and that is definitely what you are looking in a 2nd year player. Robinson is clearly better suited for man coverage than zone, because he isn't physical enough to re-route receivers from the LOS, but he has great athleticism to blanket receivers down the field. I would be ready to place a monetary bet on the fact that Robinson's performances will improve quite a lot just by the Saints' backfield reverting back to a man coverage scheme, but I also think that he has taken a lot out of this past season's problems and will improve both mentally and physically for the coming season. In my opinion, I'm still not comfortable with him even in man coverage and he doesn't do a great job of "Blanketing Receivers" downfield, just look at what Dez Bryant did to him when we played dallas and Pat robinson was in man coverage both times He made Pat Robinson look like a high school player trying to keep up with an NFL receiver And not just once, he beat Robinson twice for 54 yards and a TD each time

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