Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted

ScottF · 02-11-2014, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

Should the persecution continue?
You left out "gun nuts"... For some reason owning multiple guns makes you a nut but owning multiple cameras makes you a photographer.

Before you comment about guns that are used in crimes... Child Pornography is much more rampant locally and globally.

Oak, what did I say about guns?

Mardigras9 · 02-11-2014, 10:31 AM

I can see why he went ahead and proclaimed his choice now to avoid having to try to hide it maybe later. He came out to his college team mates already so obviously he is just interested in being himself, and good for him there.
However, it may affect his draft status because now the team that takes him knows he comes with a media circus (at least for a while), and what team wants even more drama than most of them already have.

I would love to say who really cares, but people still do, as you can see from this post alone. There is a lot of drama in every locker room in the NFL (see Richie Incognito), and this will bring some rather we think there should be or not.

ScottF · 02-11-2014, 10:34 AM

Originally Posted by SapperSaint

Chick fil a is a Christian based company. They prove that by not opening on Sunday. Will they still serve a gay customer? Yes they will. But no where does it say they HAVE TO support "GAY RIGHTS"

of course they'll serve a gay customer, they are a business first. And they are free to support all of the anti-gay groups that they choose. The issue is the discrimination of employees, documented with numerous lawsuits, not just by gays, but also by women, African-Americans, and Muslims. You can be "Christian-based". You can't be straight white male based.

Same with the Boy Scouts. You have to be accepted into a Boy Scout Troop. You just can't join. They are Christian based as well.
and like that church in Rome, they should be careful about calling out 'deviants'
Boy Scout sexual abuse files released to public

I'm sorry to say this; but we don't have to accept and bend to the will of the minority. I do believe we need to respect the minority but not change everything because 10% of the popu don't "Fit in". Just like going into a resturant in MS and having spanish on the menu. Hispanics to not even come close to 15% of the popu.

I will say this. Gay/Les comunity have had no hardships compaired to the black comunity had to endure. I've yet to see gay drinking fountains, gay restrooms, gay sections in restuants, gays can't vote. gays only work for below federal wages. I'll stop there. yes, because it is no longer the 1950's.

The gay/Les comunity need to get off of their high horse and just be what they are. Productive members of society and stop trying to force feed the rest of the world into there bidding.

but what they are, is discriminated against, just like the black community you mention

TheOak · 02-11-2014, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by ScottF

Oak, what did I say about guns?

Absolutely nothing as far as I have read. Sort of my point. Persecution is only frowned upon if it falls within certain guidelines?

Phil Robertson was persecuted by gay support activists for answering a question honestly, just as Vilma is being persecuted right now for answering a question honestly.

Phil Robertson is persecuted for his religious beliefs and practices by atheists but no one stands at a podium and tells atheists they are only acting out of fear, ignorance, or hate... And yes, the persecution did effect his work and family.

Activism has woven quite the ugly web of hypocrisy as groups of people are persecuted for hundreds of reasons but no one cares..... Unless someone tells you that its hate if you do not care.

Type of vehicle they own.
FUH2 | **** You And Your H2

Food they eat.
Even More Things Meat-Eaters Say | Vegan Food | Living | PETA

The football team they are a fan of.
Falcons fans, Cowboys fans, Seahawk fans. See smack talk area

There are many levels of persecution, all the way down to which college a persons degree is from or isn't from when a hiring manager looks at their CV.

So you will have to pardon me if I do not have more compassion towards any group of people that persecutes others in the name of ending persecution. Same parallel universe exists where someones opinion is protected by free speech but not or someone elses opinion of that opinion.

TheOak · 02-11-2014, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by ScottF

but what they are, is discriminated against, just like the black community you mention

Lack of support does not equate to discrimination. Gays are served at Chick fil et just like everyone else . They employ them, and let them use the same restrooms. Have you been to one?

So while Chick fil et' gets beat in the press for stating they believe marriage is between a man and a woman, Starbucks gets support in the press for saying they believe marriage is between a man and a man. Differing opinions, neither right or wrong... Just differing.

Gays, blacks, Catholics, Hummer owners, professional athletes, polices officers, do not need acceptance and support. People that lack self confidence and self esteem do.

At one time American Soldiers were spit on when returning from Vietnam because people didn't agree.... Today American Soldiers are treated like pawns on a chess board by our politicians, where is all the outrage?

ScottF · 02-11-2014, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

Lack of support does not equate to discrimination.
you are correct; two completely different issues, but the fact remains that CFA has had numerous suits that they lost or settled based on discrimination. Yes, every company has suits against it, but CFA is a relatively small compared to their industry. As a result, CFA has revisited and cut back on charities they sponsor
Gays are served at Chick fil et just like everyone else . They employ them, and let them use the same restrooms. Have you been to one?

Not in years, but that is just me exercising my right. I don't buy gas at BP or Exxon either

.

TheOak · 02-11-2014, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by ScottF

.

Here, I will paint a picture for you.

A Catholic, ARMY veteran, lives in Texas, works for Halliburton servicing BP. Care to guess how many levels of persecution he faces in the media daily?

Maccondo happens, and then starts the boycott of BP, and Halliburton.
Care to guess who loses his job because of the boycotts and shut down of the drilling and completion industry?

Neither BP nor Halliburton were hurt by boycotts but thousands of Louisiana and Texas residents that have jobs in the oil and gas industry lost their jobs.
Guess who came to their assistance when they were out of work?

Banks, Insurance companies, Auto makers, farmers that plant in areas where things do not grow, all get bailed out. The Oil and Gas industry gets no such sustenance.

Thanks for your boycott and lack of concern for anything but activism, and continuous persecution.

My family and I made it through that period., just like we made it through the downturn in 2006.

Dont sweat it though, I do not take it personally... Its the law of unintended consequence when people act upon an emotion rather than a thought out idea.

Tobias-Reiper · 02-11-2014, 12:34 PM

Hmmm...

Funny anecdote:

My very dear mother-in-law (I mean that, I loved that woman), God rest her soul, she was a Realtor. Her given first name and middle name were Sally Gay. She went by her middle name and married last name, which was Cash. So, her Realty add said: Gay Cash. She usually fielded calls from people asking her if that meant there was some special offer for gay people, and while most people who didn't get that Gay Cash was her actual name were either a bit embarrassed from the misunderstanding or got a chuckle out of the explanation ("My first name is Gay, my last name Cash"), the praise / bash ratio was about even: some folks would praise her for keeping her name and her choice of lifestyle (and no she was not a lesbian), some folks would bash her for things like taking advantage of the word "gay" to promote herself, and her choice of lifestyle

ScottF · 02-11-2014, 12:42 PM

Originally Posted by TheOak

Here, I will paint a picture for you.

Neither BP nor Halliburton were hurt by boycotts but thousands of Louisiana and Texas residents that have jobs in the oil and gas industry lost their jobs.
Guess who came to their assistance when they were out of work?

Banks, Insurance companies, Auto makers, farmers that plant in areas where things do not grow, all get bailed out. The Oil and Gas industry gets no such sustenance.

Thanks for your boycott and lack of concern for anything but activism, and continuous persecution.

My family and I made it through that period., just like we made it through the downturn in 2006.

So you place the blame on a customer boycott instead of BP's negligence.
And I should forgo my rights and ideals for other's economic gain.

I don't support CFA because of their promotion record with gays, women and minorities.
I don't support BP because of their malfeasance with Deepwater.
A 'lack of concern' would be if I did not care how these corporations operate, and blindly patronized them without regard to my own ideals.
If you read that as activism, or somehow persecution, so be it.

TheOak · 02-11-2014, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by ScottF

So you place the blame on a customer boycott instead of BP's negligence.
And I should forgo my rights and ideals for other's economic gain.

I don't support CFA because of their promotion record with gays, women and minorities.
I don't support BP because of their malfeasance with Deepwater.
A 'lack of concern' would be if I did not care how these corporations operate, and blindly patronized them without regard to my own ideals.
If you read that as activism, or somehow persecution, so be it.

Lets not go neck deep into the assumption pool. I never made one comment about blame for Maccondo. I know what caused it, and I know what it caused.

Idealists and activists go hand in hand but are not always understanding of the impact of what they do. Your ideals are hurting the people in your community, not BP. While I am sure it is unintentional your hurting the working man and not the Corporation.

In 2008 BP began the exit of the outright ownership of BP gas stations, at that time it owned maybe 100 of the 1000 BP gas stations in operation. Meaning that BP gas station you drive by is owned by a small business man in your community... ExxonMobil, ConocoPhillips did the same thing. When you boycott a gas station in your city you are doing absolutely nothing to BP, you are however doing a grave injustice to the John Smith that owns that convince store/gas station and is trying to make a living providing a service and a product to your community.

Are you avoiding BP gasoline by avoiding BP gas stations? Nope. Distributors buy gasoline from wholesale refiners that refine oil from many different suppliers and sell it to many different distributors. Meaning you have as much of a chance of buying gasoline refined from BP oil at a Valero as you do a BP gas station.

You see, oil is oil and it all goes to the same refineries. At those refineries it is processed into different grades of gasoline and diesel. From there it goes to distribution companies where additives are added and then it is sold to retail gas stations.

So when you see... never mind I will make it easy. Can you name 151 different gasoline brands?

Category:Oil companies of the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Category:Oil companies of the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Ironic isn't it that you try to hurt thousands in your community for the transgressions of a select group of no more than seven people that endangered the lively hood of hundreds of thousands and drive past a BP station burning gas that has been refined from BP oil. BTW, that very small select group of engineers and middle management level employees did what they did with out the knowledge of upper level executives.

And here we are nearly 3 years after Maccondo, I am telling you this not because it has any effect on me what so ever, but because the business owners in your community that support it do not deserve to be persecuted for something they had nothing to do with. You may want to give the owners of those CFA's a break also, those restaurants are not owned by CFA, they are franchises owned by people that live in your community that woke up shocked by the same press release you did, and CFA isn't hurt by your drive by.

02-11-2014, 10:02 AM	#31
ScottF 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 6,324	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Originally Posted by TheOak Should the persecution continue? You left out "gun nuts"... For some reason owning multiple guns makes you a nut but owning multiple cameras makes you a photographer. Before you comment about guns that are used in crimes... Child Pornography is much more rampant locally and globally. Oak, what did I say about guns?

02-11-2014, 10:31 AM	#32
Mardigras9 Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Land Mass between LA and AL Posts: 4,375	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted I can see why he went ahead and proclaimed his choice now to avoid having to try to hide it maybe later. He came out to his college team mates already so obviously he is just interested in being himself, and good for him there. However, it may affect his draft status because now the team that takes him knows he comes with a media circus (at least for a while), and what team wants even more drama than most of them already have. I would love to say who really cares, but people still do, as you can see from this post alone. There is a lot of drama in every locker room in the NFL (see Richie Incognito), and this will bring some rather we think there should be or not.
	"Constantly choosing the lesser of two evils is still choosing evil." - Jerry Garcia

02-11-2014, 10:34 AM	#33
ScottF 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 6,324	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Originally Posted by SapperSaint Chick fil a is a Christian based company. They prove that by not opening on Sunday. Will they still serve a gay customer? Yes they will. But no where does it say they HAVE TO support "GAY RIGHTS" of course they'll serve a gay customer, they are a business first. And they are free to support all of the anti-gay groups that they choose. The issue is the discrimination of employees, documented with numerous lawsuits, not just by gays, but also by women, African-Americans, and Muslims. You can be "Christian-based". You can't be straight white male based. Same with the Boy Scouts. You have to be accepted into a Boy Scout Troop. You just can't join. They are Christian based as well. and like that church in Rome, they should be careful about calling out 'deviants' Boy Scout sexual abuse files released to public I'm sorry to say this; but we don't have to accept and bend to the will of the minority. I do believe we need to respect the minority but not change everything because 10% of the popu don't "Fit in". Just like going into a resturant in MS and having spanish on the menu. Hispanics to not even come close to 15% of the popu. I will say this. Gay/Les comunity have had no hardships compaired to the black comunity had to endure. I've yet to see gay drinking fountains, gay restrooms, gay sections in restuants, gays can't vote. gays only work for below federal wages. I'll stop there. yes, because it is no longer the 1950's. The gay/Les comunity need to get off of their high horse and just be what they are. Productive members of society and stop trying to force feed the rest of the world into there bidding. but what they are, is discriminated against, just like the black community you mention

02-11-2014, 10:47 AM	#34
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Originally Posted by ScottF Oak, what did I say about guns? Absolutely nothing as far as I have read. Sort of my point. Persecution is only frowned upon if it falls within certain guidelines? Phil Robertson was persecuted by gay support activists for answering a question honestly, just as Vilma is being persecuted right now for answering a question honestly. Phil Robertson is persecuted for his religious beliefs and practices by atheists but no one stands at a podium and tells atheists they are only acting out of fear, ignorance, or hate... And yes, the persecution did effect his work and family. Activism has woven quite the ugly web of hypocrisy as groups of people are persecuted for hundreds of reasons but no one cares..... Unless someone tells you that its hate if you do not care. Type of vehicle they own. FUH2 \| **** You And Your H2 Food they eat. Even More Things Meat-Eaters Say \| Vegan Food \| Living \| PETA The football team they are a fan of. Falcons fans, Cowboys fans, Seahawk fans. See smack talk area There are many levels of persecution, all the way down to which college a persons degree is from or isn't from when a hiring manager looks at their CV. So you will have to pardon me if I do not have more compassion towards any group of people that persecutes others in the name of ending persecution. Same parallel universe exists where someones opinion is protected by free speech but not or someone elses opinion of that opinion.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

02-11-2014, 11:05 AM	#35
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Originally Posted by ScottF but what they are, is discriminated against, just like the black community you mention Lack of support does not equate to discrimination. Gays are served at Chick fil et just like everyone else . They employ them, and let them use the same restrooms. Have you been to one? So while Chick fil et' gets beat in the press for stating they believe marriage is between a man and a woman, Starbucks gets support in the press for saying they believe marriage is between a man and a man. Differing opinions, neither right or wrong... Just differing. Gays, blacks, Catholics, Hummer owners, professional athletes, polices officers, do not need acceptance and support. People that lack self confidence and self esteem do. At one time American Soldiers were spit on when returning from Vietnam because people didn't agree.... Today American Soldiers are treated like pawns on a chess board by our politicians, where is all the outrage? SapperSaint likes this.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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02-11-2014, 11:30 AM	#36
ScottF 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 6,324	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Originally Posted by TheOak Lack of support does not equate to discrimination. you are correct; two completely different issues, but the fact remains that CFA has had numerous suits that they lost or settled based on discrimination. Yes, every company has suits against it, but CFA is a relatively small compared to their industry. As a result, CFA has revisited and cut back on charities they sponsor Gays are served at Chick fil et just like everyone else . They employ them, and let them use the same restrooms. Have you been to one? Not in years, but that is just me exercising my right. I don't buy gas at BP or Exxon either .

02-11-2014, 11:51 AM	#37
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Originally Posted by ScottF . Here, I will paint a picture for you. A Catholic, ARMY veteran, lives in Texas, works for Halliburton servicing BP. Care to guess how many levels of persecution he faces in the media daily? Maccondo happens, and then starts the boycott of BP, and Halliburton. Care to guess who loses his job because of the boycotts and shut down of the drilling and completion industry? Neither BP nor Halliburton were hurt by boycotts but thousands of Louisiana and Texas residents that have jobs in the oil and gas industry lost their jobs. Guess who came to their assistance when they were out of work? Banks, Insurance companies, Auto makers, farmers that plant in areas where things do not grow, all get bailed out. The Oil and Gas industry gets no such sustenance. Thanks for your boycott and lack of concern for anything but activism, and continuous persecution. My family and I made it through that period., just like we made it through the downturn in 2006. Dont sweat it though, I do not take it personally... Its the law of unintended consequence when people act upon an emotion rather than a thought out idea. SapperSaint likes this.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau Last edited by TheOak; 02-11-2014 at 12:31 PM..

02-11-2014, 12:34 PM	#38
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Hmmm... Funny anecdote: My very dear mother-in-law (I mean that, I loved that woman), God rest her soul, she was a Realtor. Her given first name and middle name were Sally Gay. She went by her middle name and married last name, which was Cash. So, her Realty add said: Gay Cash. She usually fielded calls from people asking her if that meant there was some special offer for gay people, and while most people who didn't get that Gay Cash was her actual name were either a bit embarrassed from the misunderstanding or got a chuckle out of the explanation ("My first name is Gay, my last name Cash"), the praise / bash ratio was about even: some folks would praise her for keeping her name and her choice of lifestyle (and no she was not a lesbian), some folks would bash her for things like taking advantage of the word "gay" to promote herself, and her choice of lifestyle Danno likes this.
	'Cause the simple man pays the thrills, the bills and the pills that kill

02-11-2014, 12:42 PM	#39
ScottF 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 6,324	Re: Michael Sam comes out, An openly gay player very likely to be drafted Originally Posted by TheOak Here, I will paint a picture for you. Neither BP nor Halliburton were hurt by boycotts but thousands of Louisiana and Texas residents that have jobs in the oil and gas industry lost their jobs. Guess who came to their assistance when they were out of work? Banks, Insurance companies, Auto makers, farmers that plant in areas where things do not grow, all get bailed out. The Oil and Gas industry gets no such sustenance. Thanks for your boycott and lack of concern for anything but activism, and continuous persecution. My family and I made it through that period., just like we made it through the downturn in 2006. So you place the blame on a customer boycott instead of BP's negligence. And I should forgo my rights and ideals for other's economic gain. I don't support CFA because of their promotion record with gays, women and minorities. I don't support BP because of their malfeasance with Deepwater. A 'lack of concern' would be if I did not care how these corporations operate, and blindly patronized them without regard to my own ideals. If you read that as activism, or somehow persecution, so be it. Utah_Saint likes this.

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