Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season?

NonieT · 02-27-2014, 11:37 AM

I think they should tag him with the non-exclusive tag. That way he can negotiate with other teams and we get something for him. He isn't worth a cent over 8 mil and not sure he's even worth that much.. I know, I kwow, he's the best TE in the NFL but he isn't irreplaceable. The only one who is irreplacble is Brees.

ClintSaints · 02-27-2014, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

He isn't worth $12 million a year. Everyone, including Jimmy and his agent know that. No team will pay that kind of money. So that point is moot.

The real question is what is he worth?

1) The TE tag is somewhere are $6.5 million a year right?

2) Gronk's contract is 8 years $55 million. Technically that's about $7 million a year. But only $13 million of it is guaranteed up to 2016 (with the addition of a $10 million option bonus if the Pats decide to take him on until 2020).

3) The WR tag is $11.5 million per year.

It's pretty easy to argue that JG is the best TE in the game. But he isn't a WR. So it would seem reasonable that something that's better than Gronk's contract, but less than a premier WR contract (Megatron, Fitzgerald) is in order.

JG is going to get tagged because neither side is going to cave to the other this early in the game. So honestly until the tag, the grievance, and the appeal are all done, JG's value cannot yet be determined. It's likely that if he's tagged as TE that the average salary will be closer to $8 million. If the WR tag stands after appeal, then that's an entirely different discussion.

SFIAH

I thought Gronk's contract was six years, $53 million.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 02-27-2014, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

He isn't worth $12 million a year. Everyone, including Jimmy and his agent know that. No team will pay that kind of money. So that point is moot.

The real question is what is he worth?

1) The TE tag is somewhere are $6.5 million a year right?

2) Gronk's contract is 8 years $55 million. Technically that's about $7 million a year. But only $13 million of it is guaranteed up to 2016 (with the addition of a $10 million option bonus if the Pats decide to take him on until 2020).

SFIAH

Originally Posted by ClintSaints

I thought Gronk's contract was six years, $53 million.

Rob Gronkowski Salary Cap, Contracts, Salaries, Cap Hits, & News Profile

It's so heavily backloaded that the last two years would likely not be paid (or restructured). But as signed it is an 8 year contract if you include option years.

NFL contracts are smoke and mirrors. The only numbers that are real are the signing bonus and the annual salary numbers. Any team can cut any player pretty much at any time during the contract as long as they are willing to eat the dead money over a year (or two). In short a 5 year/$50 million contract with $30 million in salary in the last 2 years and a $15 million signing bonus really isn't a $50 million contract. It's a 3 year/$20 million contract because the player will be cut after year three when the salary escalates.

SFIAH

Utah_Saint · 02-27-2014, 02:55 PM

Originally Posted by rezburna

.... But I don't see a TE ever deserving $12 million a year. I don't even see a receiver outside of Megatron deserving that.

Yeah, I agree. I don't think his agent really expects to get 12 mill/year. I think there will be more than one team willing to pay 10 though.

AlaskaSaints · 02-27-2014, 04:03 PM

Let the injury prone, short-armed, stone-handed chump GO.

I forgot non-blocking...

Alaska

AlaskaSaints · 02-27-2014, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by NonieT

The only one who is irreplacble is Brees.

I wouldn't even say [that].

Two, actually three QB's played in the Super Bowl who were not named Drew Brees.

Greed is eating us from within.

Alaska

Papa Voodoo · 02-27-2014, 04:19 PM

Jimmy's not asking for anything...his agent is. If they can break open the roster designation then agents will make more money. Jimmy will get signed after all that plays out.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 02-27-2014, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by NonieT

The only one who is irreplacble is Brees.

Originally Posted by AlaskaSaints

I wouldn't even say [that].

Two, actually three QB's played in the Super Bowl who were not named Drew Brees.

Greed is eating us from within.

Alaska

My counter to that is that for the New Orleans Saints that one and only one QB played in the Super Bowl for the team. And won it. And has help put the team in the position of being a playoff contender virtually every year.

Sometimes I think people forget how really remarkable it is that Brees has passed for 5000 yards FOR THREE CONSECUTIVE SEASONS!. 5000 passing yards is a feat that has only been attained by 5 QBs in the history of the game, and only Brees has ever accomplished it more than once.

We need to agree that organizations win Super Bowls. The Saints in their current configuration, with Brees, have not only put the organization in a position to win it, but actually accomplished it.

SFIAH

voodooido · 02-27-2014, 05:35 PM

My thought is if he will not come off his high horse I would do a sign and trade. Easily get a rd 1 and 2 this year for him. As deep is this draft is imagine the talent you could get with those 2 picks.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 02-27-2014, 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by voodooido

My thought is if he will not come off his high horse I would do a sign and trade. Easily get a rd 1 and 2 this year for him. As deep is this draft is imagine the talent you could get with those 2 picks.

Exactly how do you trade a player that's not under contract? Unless Jimmy is tagged, he is a free agent as of March 11th. If he is tagged, the Saints still do not own his rights until he signs the tender.

A sign and trade works for restricted free agents because the team still holds the rights to the player. But not UFAs.

SFIAH

02-27-2014, 11:37 AM	#81
NonieT 500th Post Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 921	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? I think they should tag him with the non-exclusive tag. That way he can negotiate with other teams and we get something for him. He isn't worth a cent over 8 mil and not sure he's even worth that much.. I know, I kwow, he's the best TE in the NFL but he isn't irreplaceable. The only one who is irreplacble is Brees.
NonieT 500th Post Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 921

02-27-2014, 12:18 PM	#82
ClintSaints 500th Post Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Glendale, CA Posts: 603	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL He isn't worth $12 million a year. Everyone, including Jimmy and his agent know that. No team will pay that kind of money. So that point is moot. The real question is what is he worth? 1) The TE tag is somewhere are $6.5 million a year right? 2) Gronk's contract is 8 years $55 million. Technically that's about $7 million a year. But only $13 million of it is guaranteed up to 2016 (with the addition of a $10 million option bonus if the Pats decide to take him on until 2020). 3) The WR tag is $11.5 million per year. It's pretty easy to argue that JG is the best TE in the game. But he isn't a WR. So it would seem reasonable that something that's better than Gronk's contract, but less than a premier WR contract (Megatron, Fitzgerald) is in order. JG is going to get tagged because neither side is going to cave to the other this early in the game. So honestly until the tag, the grievance, and the appeal are all done, JG's value cannot yet be determined. It's likely that if he's tagged as TE that the average salary will be closer to $8 million. If the WR tag stands after appeal, then that's an entirely different discussion. SFIAH I thought Gronk's contract was six years, $53 million.

02-27-2014, 12:34 PM	#83
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,773	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL He isn't worth $12 million a year. Everyone, including Jimmy and his agent know that. No team will pay that kind of money. So that point is moot. The real question is what is he worth? 1) The TE tag is somewhere are $6.5 million a year right? 2) Gronk's contract is 8 years $55 million. Technically that's about $7 million a year. But only $13 million of it is guaranteed up to 2016 (with the addition of a $10 million option bonus if the Pats decide to take him on until 2020). SFIAH Originally Posted by ClintSaints I thought Gronk's contract was six years, $53 million. Rob Gronkowski Salary Cap, Contracts, Salaries, Cap Hits, & News Profile It's so heavily backloaded that the last two years would likely not be paid (or restructured). But as signed it is an 8 year contract if you include option years. NFL contracts are smoke and mirrors. The only numbers that are real are the signing bonus and the annual salary numbers. Any team can cut any player pretty much at any time during the contract as long as they are willing to eat the dead money over a year (or two). In short a 5 year/$50 million contract with $30 million in salary in the last 2 years and a $15 million signing bonus really isn't a $50 million contract. It's a 3 year/$20 million contract because the player will be cut after year three when the salary escalates. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

02-27-2014, 02:55 PM	#84
Utah_Saint Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 3,521	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Originally Posted by rezburna .... But I don't see a TE ever deserving $12 million a year. I don't even see a receiver outside of Megatron deserving that. Yeah, I agree. I don't think his agent really expects to get 12 mill/year. I think there will be more than one team willing to pay 10 though.

02-27-2014, 04:03 PM	#85
AlaskaSaints 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Anchorage, AK Posts: 2,484 Blog Entries: 2	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Let the injury prone, short-armed, stone-handed chump GO. I forgot non-blocking... Alaska

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02-27-2014, 04:07 PM	#86
AlaskaSaints 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Anchorage, AK Posts: 2,484 Blog Entries: 2	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Originally Posted by NonieT The only one who is irreplacble is Brees. I wouldn't even say [that]. Two, actually three QB's played in the Super Bowl who were not named Drew Brees. Greed is eating us from within. Alaska

02-27-2014, 04:19 PM	#87
Papa Voodoo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,633	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Jimmy's not asking for anything...his agent is. If they can break open the roster designation then agents will make more money. Jimmy will get signed after all that plays out. SaintFanInATLHELL likes this.

02-27-2014, 05:21 PM	#88
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,773	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Originally Posted by NonieT The only one who is irreplacble is Brees. Originally Posted by AlaskaSaints I wouldn't even say [that]. Two, actually three QB's played in the Super Bowl who were not named Drew Brees. Greed is eating us from within. Alaska My counter to that is that for the New Orleans Saints that one and only one QB played in the Super Bowl for the team. And won it. And has help put the team in the position of being a playoff contender virtually every year. Sometimes I think people forget how really remarkable it is that Brees has passed for 5000 yards FOR THREE CONSECUTIVE SEASONS!. 5000 passing yards is a feat that has only been attained by 5 QBs in the history of the game, and only Brees has ever accomplished it more than once. We need to agree that organizations win Super Bowls. The Saints in their current configuration, with Brees, have not only put the organization in a position to win it, but actually accomplished it. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

02-27-2014, 05:35 PM	#89
voodooido 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 2,766	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? My thought is if he will not come off his high horse I would do a sign and trade. Easily get a rd 1 and 2 this year for him. As deep is this draft is imagine the talent you could get with those 2 picks. AlaskaSaints likes this.
voodooido 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 2,766

02-27-2014, 08:36 PM	#90
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,773	Re: Jimmy Graham demanding 12 million per season? Originally Posted by voodooido My thought is if he will not come off his high horse I would do a sign and trade. Easily get a rd 1 and 2 this year for him. As deep is this draft is imagine the talent you could get with those 2 picks. Exactly how do you trade a player that's not under contract? Unless Jimmy is tagged, he is a free agent as of March 11th. If he is tagged, the Saints still do not own his rights until he signs the tender. A sign and trade works for restricted free agents because the team still holds the rights to the player. But not UFAs. SFIAH

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