Fire Sean Payton

spkb25 · 10-03-2016, 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

We don't have debth because we don't have cap... thanks to Bree's

That is not an honest assessment. we have like 35 million in dead money, I am going to go ahead and blame that. Drew is earning what every qb earns

Rugby Saint II · 10-03-2016, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

Heard an interesting sound byte from Mike and Mike last week ...

The Saints were 3rd in the NFL on spending for offensive players and 31st for the defense.

Even before injuries this defense was bad...very bad. I actually believe Mickey Loomis is a bigger problem than Payton. He (Loomis) is either a bad personnel guy or he is not a personnel guy at all. Either way this isn't acceptable for a GM.

No matter how any of us feel about Loomis, no one can deny it's insane to have one man serving as GM for two Pro sport teams. It's too much for one man.

Benson needs to limit Loomis to cap management and stay away from player evaluation and acquisition. Oh, and stop multi tasking the Pelicans and Saints. Pick one and stay there! Then Benson needs to limit Payton's power tremendously. I realize Ireland has been good at evaluating defense but has been hog tied by scheme changes. We have already cleaned house in the scouting department. Give the existing plan time to develop.

Still, I believe it's time for a fresh perspective.

The Dude · 10-03-2016, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by spkb25

That is not an honest assessment. we have like 35 million in dead money, I am going to go ahead and blame that. Drew is earning what every qb earns

Agreed. You forgot to add poor drafting and poor FA signings. Anyone who blamed Brees for this has very little knowledge of the game much less the business of football. All players get the maximum they can for the production on the field. Brees is no different. It's just what QBs like Brees get paid. People also forget he was grossly underpaid for his production prior to the contract.

Euphoria · 10-03-2016, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by The Dude

Agreed. You forgot to add poor drafting and poor FA signings. Anyone who blamed Brees for this has very little knowledge of the game much less the business of football. All players get the maximum they can for the production on the field. Brees is no different. It's just what QBs like Brees get paid. People also forget he was grossly underpaid for his production prior to the contract.

Someone may want to look at other teams who have lests say less of a QB but can afford deep rosters of talent across the team. If you QB has a bad day - you lose. The other teams not so much.

Hell look at the teams who as of now ranked #1 in their divisions... all of them ranked #1 do not have a top teir QB. Even the Pats who have a 2nd and 3rd string starting ended up iwth a 3-1 record with out Brady.

So don't give me that personal attack about not knowing football - this is fact.

The Dude · 10-03-2016, 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

Dude,
Wasn't that bad? After week #1 of the season the Saints ranked :

#31st in total defense.
#28th in passing defense.
#25th in rushing defense.

This defense has been bad for a while. Multiple seasons of anemic, last place rankings. At some point you can't keep pointing fingers at injuries.

BEFORE injuries. We lost Lewis and 2 other starters before the season started. We looked pretty solid going in. We would have had what looks to be solid backups too unless ALL starters were injured which is exactly what happened

burningmetal · 10-03-2016, 04:00 PM

Originally Posted by The Dude

BEFORE injuries. We lost Lewis and 2 other starters before the season started. We looked pretty solid going in. We would have had what looks to be solid backups too unless ALL starters were injured which is exactly what happened

We HOPED the defense was better coming in. But you're talking about guys who were part of a horrible defense a year ago. You can't say affirmatively that we were looking better coming in. I had my hopes just like anybody else. But until this regime proves they can develop a defense, I'm not going to sit here and say we'd have a good defense without injuries. We'd be better at corner, for sure. But without a consistent pass rush, even better cornerbacks can't hold up.

Breaux and Ellerbe are impact guys. I haven't seen enough of P.J. Williams, and haven't seen any of Rankins. Kikaha flashed his quickness last year, but was a one trick pony who got easily fazed out too often. So it's really difficult to judge where we'd be. I look forward to getting at least some of them back to see what happens. In the mean time, the offense is going to have to suck it up. They've been very inconsistent so far.

Budsdrinker · 10-03-2016, 04:03 PM

Majority of our starters the past couple games were suppose to be back ups so in training camp we had depth. Injuries took that depth away. If you listened to Jen Hale before 2nd half started she said Payton told her they were trying to protect the young guys on D with zone but mental mistakes put them out of position so in the 2nd half they were switching to man to make it less complicated. Sounds like good coaching to me.

neugey · 10-03-2016, 05:25 PM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

Someone may want to look at other teams who have lests say less of a QB but can afford deep rosters of talent across the team. If you QB has a bad day - you lose. The other teams not so much.

Hell look at the teams who as of now ranked #1 in their divisions... all of them ranked #1 do not have a top teir QB. Even the Pats who have a 2nd and 3rd string starting ended up iwth a 3-1 record with out Brady.

So don't give me that personal attack about not knowing football - this is fact.

The Pats, Vikings, Broncos, perhaps the Eagles all have the blueprint for winning consistently in today's NFL - a talented, aggressive, well-stocked, well-coached defense. When you can stymie the likes of Aaron Rodgers like the Vikings did, you can afford to punt the ball and basically win by default.

If our Dome Patrol existed in today's game, we'd be a more dominant version of the Broncos.

skymike · 10-03-2016, 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by neugey

The Pats, Vikings, Broncos, perhaps the Eagles all have the blueprint for winning consistently in today's NFL - a talented, aggressive, well-stocked, well-coached defense. When you can stymie the likes of Aaron Rodgers like the Vikings did, you can afford to punt the ball and basically win by default.

If our Dome Patrol existed in today's game, we'd be a more dominant version of the Broncos.

Im just going to like this post, because you invoked one of my favorite phrases and memories. Dome Patrol!

44Champs · 10-03-2016, 08:41 PM

Originally Posted by neugey

The Pats, Vikings, Broncos, perhaps the Eagles all have the blueprint for winning consistently in today's NFL - a talented, aggressive, well-stocked, well-coached defense. When you can stymie the likes of Aaron Rodgers like the Vikings did, you can afford to punt the ball and basically win by default.

If our Dome Patrol existed in today's game, we'd be a more dominant version of the Broncos.

The one thing all those teams do well is TACKLE! It's such a basic fundamental, yet our D doesnt do it well. It's like we'd rather get the big hit than make tackle. I'd be interested to see how many yards after touch we're giving up.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

10-03-2016, 01:44 PM	#51
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,049	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by Euphoria We don't have debth because we don't have cap... thanks to Bree's That is not an honest assessment. we have like 35 million in dead money, I am going to go ahead and blame that. Drew is earning what every qb earns jnormand likes this.

10-03-2016, 02:21 PM	#52
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 22,223	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by K Major Heard an interesting sound byte from Mike and Mike last week ... The Saints were 3rd* in the NFL on spending for offensive players and 31st for the defense.* Even before injuries this defense was bad...very bad. I actually believe Mickey Loomis is a bigger problem than Payton. He (Loomis) is either a bad personnel guy or he is not a personnel guy at all. Either way this isn't acceptable for a GM. No matter how any of us feel about Loomis, no one can deny it's insane to have one man serving as GM for two Pro sport teams. It's too much for one man. Benson needs to limit Loomis to cap management and stay away from player evaluation and acquisition. Oh, and stop multi tasking the Pelicans and Saints. Pick one and stay there! Then Benson needs to limit Payton's power tremendously. I realize Ireland has been good at evaluating defense but has been hog tied by scheme changes. We have already cleaned house in the scouting department. Give the existing plan time to develop. Still, I believe it's time for a fresh perspective.

10-03-2016, 03:06 PM	#53
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 8,895	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by spkb25 That is not an honest assessment. we have like 35 million in dead money, I am going to go ahead and blame that. Drew is earning what every qb earns Agreed. You forgot to add poor drafting and poor FA signings. Anyone who blamed Brees for this has very little knowledge of the game much less the business of football. All players get the maximum they can for the production on the field. Brees is no different. It's just what QBs like Brees get paid. People also forget he was grossly underpaid for his production prior to the contract.
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 8,895

10-03-2016, 03:21 PM	#54
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by The Dude Agreed. You forgot to add poor drafting and poor FA signings. Anyone who blamed Brees for this has very little knowledge of the game much less the business of football. All players get the maximum they can for the production on the field. Brees is no different. It's just what QBs like Brees get paid. People also forget he was grossly underpaid for his production prior to the contract. Someone may want to look at other teams who have lests say less of a QB but can afford deep rosters of talent across the team. If you QB has a bad day - you lose. The other teams not so much. Hell look at the teams who as of now ranked #1 in their divisions... all of them ranked #1 do not have a top teir QB. Even the Pats who have a 2nd and 3rd string starting ended up iwth a 3-1 record with out Brady. So don't give me that personal attack about not knowing football - this is fact.
	E U P H O R I A

10-03-2016, 03:38 PM	#55
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 8,895	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by K Major Dude, Wasn't that bad? After week #1 of the season the Saints ranked : #31st in total defense. #28th in passing defense. #25th in rushing defense. This defense has been bad for a while. Multiple seasons of anemic, last place rankings. At some point you can't keep pointing fingers at injuries. BEFORE injuries. We lost Lewis and 2 other starters before the season started. We looked pretty solid going in. We would have had what looks to be solid backups too unless ALL starters were injured which is exactly what happened
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 8,895

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10-03-2016, 04:00 PM	#56
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,903 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by The Dude BEFORE injuries. We lost Lewis and 2 other starters before the season started. We looked pretty solid going in. We would have had what looks to be solid backups too unless ALL starters were injured which is exactly what happened We HOPED the defense was better coming in. But you're talking about guys who were part of a horrible defense a year ago. You can't say affirmatively that we were looking better coming in. I had my hopes just like anybody else. But until this regime proves they can develop a defense, I'm not going to sit here and say we'd have a good defense without injuries. We'd be better at corner, for sure. But without a consistent pass rush, even better cornerbacks can't hold up. Breaux and Ellerbe are impact guys. I haven't seen enough of P.J. Williams, and haven't seen any of Rankins. Kikaha flashed his quickness last year, but was a one trick pony who got easily fazed out too often. So it's really difficult to judge where we'd be. I look forward to getting at least some of them back to see what happens. In the mean time, the offense is going to have to suck it up. They've been very inconsistent so far. K Major likes this.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

10-03-2016, 04:03 PM	#57
Budsdrinker A Cajun Transforming TX Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Woodlands, Texas Posts: 2,782	Re: Fire Sean Payton Majority of our starters the past couple games were suppose to be back ups so in training camp we had depth. Injuries took that depth away. If you listened to Jen Hale before 2nd half started she said Payton told her they were trying to protect the young guys on D with zone but mental mistakes put them out of position so in the 2nd half they were switching to man to make it less complicated. Sounds like good coaching to me. skymike likes this.

10-03-2016, 05:25 PM	#58
neugey Hu Dat! Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 6,241 Blog Entries: 13	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by Euphoria Someone may want to look at other teams who have lests say less of a QB but can afford deep rosters of talent across the team. If you QB has a bad day - you lose. The other teams not so much. Hell look at the teams who as of now ranked #1 in their divisions... all of them ranked #1 do not have a top teir QB. Even the Pats who have a 2nd and 3rd string starting ended up iwth a 3-1 record with out Brady. So don't give me that personal attack about not knowing football - this is fact. The Pats, Vikings, Broncos, perhaps the Eagles all have the blueprint for winning consistently in today's NFL - a talented, aggressive, well-stocked, well-coached defense. When you can stymie the likes of Aaron Rodgers like the Vikings did, you can afford to punt the ball and basically win by default. If our Dome Patrol existed in today's game, we'd be a more dominant version of the Broncos. skymike and 44Champs like this.

10-03-2016, 07:23 PM	#59
skymike E. Side Cholo Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: The Barrio, H-town Posts: 6,089	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by neugey The Pats, Vikings, Broncos, perhaps the Eagles all have the blueprint for winning consistently in today's NFL - a talented, aggressive, well-stocked, well-coached defense. When you can stymie the likes of Aaron Rodgers like the Vikings did, you can afford to punt the ball and basically win by default. If our Dome Patrol existed in today's game, we'd be a more dominant version of the Broncos. Im just going to like this post, because you invoked one of my favorite phrases and memories. Dome Patrol!

10-03-2016, 08:41 PM	#60
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589	Re: Fire Sean Payton Originally Posted by neugey The Pats, Vikings, Broncos, perhaps the Eagles all have the blueprint for winning consistently in today's NFL - a talented, aggressive, well-stocked, well-coached defense. When you can stymie the likes of Aaron Rodgers like the Vikings did, you can afford to punt the ball and basically win by default. If our Dome Patrol existed in today's game, we'd be a more dominant version of the Broncos. The one thing all those teams do well is TACKLE! It's such a basic fundamental, yet our D doesnt do it well. It's like we'd rather get the big hit than make tackle. I'd be interested to see how many yards after touch we're giving up. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk K Major likes this.
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589

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