Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers

Boston Saint · 11-28-2022, 01:19 PM

The main/only things from this loss that I would pin on Allen are not going for it on 4th and short earlier in the game and not trying more quick throws/slants.

Otherwise they were going against a good Niners D on the road. his best player in Kamara let him down with fumbles. His kicker let him down. The refs let him down with poor calls, The tipped balls went the niners way.

This is not an excuse. This is not a vote of confidence in Allen. This is my evaluation of his performance. I don’t know what Payton would have done differently to overcome those fumbles, missed kicks, and calls.

Sinner · 11-28-2022, 01:52 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

The main/only things from this loss that I would pin on Allen are not going for it on 4th and short earlier in the game and not trying more quick throws/slants.

Otherwise they were going against a good Niners D on the road. his best player in Kamara let him down with fumbles. His kicker let him down. The refs let him down with poor calls, The tipped balls went the niners way.

This is not an excuse. This is not a vote of confidence in Allen. This is my evaluation of his performance. I don’t know what Payton would have done differently to overcome those fumbles, missed kicks, and calls.

Perhaps Payton would have COACHED differently?

AsylumGuido · 11-28-2022, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

Perhaps Payton would have COACHED differently?

In what way? The only thing Allen had control over during the game was defensive playcalling. The defense actually did a tremendous job. All the offensive playcalling was on Carmichael.

Sinner · 11-28-2022, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

In what way? The only thing Allen had control over during the game was defensive playcalling. The defense actually did a tremendous job. All the offensive playcalling was on Carmichael.

So the Head Coach doesn't pay any attention or have anything to do with what we just saw on Sunday? Times have changed.

AsylumGuido · 11-28-2022, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

So the Head Coach doesn't pay any attention or have anything to do with what we just saw on Sunday? Times have changed.

Nope. Not saying that at all. In game decisions such as going for it or not on 4th down or game clock management is mostly on the head coach, of course. But if coaching was to blame for mistakes made by the players it is more on the shoulders of the positional coaches and that comes on what they do during the week. But, once the game kicks off everything else other than playcalling falls on the players themselves. The head coach isn't fumbling the ball, missing tackles, or taking a pass off their facemask.

Boston Saint · 11-28-2022, 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

Perhaps Payton would have COACHED differently?

Perhaps. I might be wrong. I can’t see that coaching would have stopped the missed FG, The bad calls, and Kamara’s fumbles. That was my point. PleSe tell me What could Payton have done to prevent THOSE SPECIFIC THINGS.

Sinner · 11-28-2022, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

Perhaps. I might be wrong. I can’t see that coaching would have stopped the missed FG, The bad calls, and Kamara’s fumbles. That was my point. PleSe tell me What could Payton have done to prevent THOSE SPECIFIC THINGS.

"Bad calls" aside, a Head Coach having nothing to do with his Star Running Back's fumbles... or his Kicker missing Field Goals... or his Receiver not holding on to the ball as he hits the ground... would have to be either blind, or ineffective. PERIOD.

Boston Saint · 11-28-2022, 04:13 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

"Bad calls" aside, a Head Coach having nothing to do with his Star Running Back's fumbles... or his Kicker missing Field Goals... or his Receiver not holding on to the ball as he hits the ground... would have to be either blind, or ineffective. PERIOD.

So that doesn’t answer my question. What do you do to prevent a missed FG or Kamara fumbling? What Magic did Payton have that told Kamara not to fumble and why does Kamara feel it’s Ok to fumble now ?

Boston Saint · 11-28-2022, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

"Bad calls" aside, a Head Coach having nothing to do with his Star Running Back's fumbles... or his Kicker missing Field Goals... or his Receiver not holding on to the ball as he hits the ground... would have to be either blind, or ineffective. PERIOD.

Sinner, by this logic a coach could design the perfect play for a QB to hit a wide open receiver and because the QB makes a poor throw or the receiver drops the pass or fumbles after catching it or the ref calls a BS PI call the coach is at fault.

AsylumGuido · 11-28-2022, 04:27 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

So that doesn’t answer my question. What do you do to prevent a missed FG or Kamara fumbling? What Magic did Payton have that told Kamara not to fumble and why does Kamara feel it’s Ok to fumble now ?

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

Sinner, by this logic a coach could design the perfect play for a QB to hit a wide open receiver and because the QB makes a poor throw or the receiver drops the pass or fumbles after catching it or the ref calls a BS PI call the coach is at fault.

Ditto and ditto.

11-28-2022, 01:19 PM	#1
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers The main/only things from this loss that I would pin on Allen are not going for it on 4th and short earlier in the game and not trying more quick throws/slants. Otherwise they were going against a good Niners D on the road. his best player in Kamara let him down with fumbles. His kicker let him down. The refs let him down with poor calls, The tipped balls went the niners way. This is not an excuse. This is not a vote of confidence in Allen. This is my evaluation of his performance. I don’t know what Payton would have done differently to overcome those fumbles, missed kicks, and calls.
	You think you know, but you don’t know...and you never will! Coach Jim Mora

11-28-2022, 01:52 PM	#2
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Boston Saint The main/only things from this loss that I would pin on Allen are not going for it on 4th and short earlier in the game and not trying more quick throws/slants. Otherwise they were going against a good Niners D on the road. his best player in Kamara let him down with fumbles. His kicker let him down. The refs let him down with poor calls, The tipped balls went the niners way. This is not an excuse. This is not a vote of confidence in Allen. This is my evaluation of his performance. I don’t know what Payton would have done differently to overcome those fumbles, missed kicks, and calls. Perhaps Payton would have COACHED differently? Rueben Mayes and K Major like this.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068

11-28-2022, 01:57 PM	#3
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,622	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Sinner Perhaps Payton would have COACHED differently? In what way? The only thing Allen had control over during the game was defensive playcalling. The defense actually did a tremendous job. All the offensive playcalling was on Carmichael.

11-28-2022, 02:29 PM	#4
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by AsylumGuido In what way? The only thing Allen had control over during the game was defensive playcalling. The defense actually did a tremendous job. All the offensive playcalling was on Carmichael. So the Head Coach doesn't pay any attention or have anything to do with what we just saw on Sunday? Times have changed. K Major likes this.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068

11-28-2022, 04:24 PM	#5
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,622	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Sinner So the Head Coach doesn't pay any attention or have anything to do with what we just saw on Sunday? Times have changed. Nope. Not saying that at all. In game decisions such as going for it or not on 4th down or game clock management is mostly on the head coach, of course. But if coaching was to blame for mistakes made by the players it is more on the shoulders of the positional coaches and that comes on what they do during the week. But, once the game kicks off everything else other than playcalling falls on the players themselves. The head coach isn't fumbling the ball, missing tackles, or taking a pass off their facemask.

11-28-2022, 03:00 PM	#6
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Sinner Perhaps Payton would have COACHED differently? Perhaps. I might be wrong. I can’t see that coaching would have stopped the missed FG, The bad calls, and Kamara’s fumbles. That was my point. PleSe tell me What could Payton have done to prevent THOSE SPECIFIC THINGS. AsylumGuido and Rueben Mayes like this.

11-28-2022, 03:09 PM	#7
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Boston Saint Perhaps. I might be wrong. I can’t see that coaching would have stopped the missed FG, The bad calls, and Kamara’s fumbles. That was my point. PleSe tell me What could Payton have done to prevent THOSE SPECIFIC THINGS. "Bad calls" aside, a Head Coach having nothing to do with his Star Running Back's fumbles... or his Kicker missing Field Goals... or his Receiver not holding on to the ball as he hits the ground... would have to be either blind, or ineffective. PERIOD. dizzle88 likes this.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068

11-28-2022, 04:13 PM	#8
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Sinner "Bad calls" aside, a Head Coach having nothing to do with his Star Running Back's fumbles... or his Kicker missing Field Goals... or his Receiver not holding on to the ball as he hits the ground... would have to be either blind, or ineffective. PERIOD. So that doesn’t answer my question. What do you do to prevent a missed FG or Kamara fumbling? What Magic did Payton have that told Kamara not to fumble and why does Kamara feel it’s Ok to fumble now ? AsylumGuido likes this.

11-28-2022, 04:19 PM	#9
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Sinner "Bad calls" aside, a Head Coach having nothing to do with his Star Running Back's fumbles... or his Kicker missing Field Goals... or his Receiver not holding on to the ball as he hits the ground... would have to be either blind, or ineffective. PERIOD. Sinner, by this logic a coach could design the perfect play for a QB to hit a wide open receiver and because the QB makes a poor throw or the receiver drops the pass or fumbles after catching it or the ref calls a BS PI call the coach is at fault. AsylumGuido likes this.

11-28-2022, 04:27 PM	#10
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,622	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Boston Saint So that doesn’t answer my question. What do you do to prevent a missed FG or Kamara fumbling? What Magic did Payton have that told Kamara not to fumble and why does Kamara feel it’s Ok to fumble now ? Originally Posted by Boston Saint Sinner, by this logic a coach could design the perfect play for a QB to hit a wide open receiver and because the QB makes a poor throw or the receiver drops the pass or fumbles after catching it or the ref calls a BS PI call the coach is at fault. Ditto and ditto.