Evaluating Coaches
 

Let's talk about coaches. There needs to be substantial shake up in the team direction and who's taking us there. Who should we keep and who's on the cutting block? This is what I found after a quick look at their bios. I did not list assistant coaches but feel free to discuss them too.


Offense:

Dennis Allen. Head coach. Allen had another abysmal season as a head coach after failing with the Raiders in his first attempt. He's a good DC but he's in way over his head as a Head coach.

Pete Carmichael. Offensive Coordinator. Carmichael's job security is gone after 14 seasons as OC, mostly under Sean Payton.

Ronald Curry. Passing Game Coordinator/Quarterbacks coach. Curry is considered a top offensive young mind who has been in the NFL 17 seasons.

Dan Roushar. Roushar is the run game coordinator/tight ends coach. He's been with the Saints for 9 years. He made Juwan Johnson, a converted UDFA wideout, our best receiving TE since Jeremy Shockey.

Joel Thomas. Running backs coach. Thomas has been the Saints running backs coach for seven seasons. I have to credit him for some of AK's success.

Kodi Burns. WR's coach. Burns has been here one year and has done an amazing job with developing Olave and Shaheed rookie receivers into deep threats. He comes from UT with experience developing players.

Doug Marrone. Offensive line coach. Marrone did well in his first stint with New Orleans but has struggled since his return. He helped to finally developed Ruiz last season.

Defense:

Ryan Nielsen: Co-Defensive Coordinator/Defensive line. Nielsen has been in charge of the D-line for six years and is highly sought after for vacant coaching spots.

Kris Richard. Co-defensive Coordinator/Secondary coach. Richard joined the Saints in 2021 and helped solidify the back end. We are widely respected for our secondary with a lot of the credit due to him. He is also sought after this coaching cycle.

Peter Guinta. Senior defensive assistant. 43 year coaching veteran with three Super bowl Championships.

Michael Hodges. Linebackers coach. He has developed Pete Werner and Ellis into starters and the room is solid.

Special Teams:

Darren Rizzi. Special teams have been up and down in New Orleans since 2019, but mostly up. He was the Saints assistant head coach in 2022 as well.


This was almost a poll but I changes my mind.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Nice breakdown. Begin with Dennis Allen. Now.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Too late. We already know he's going to be back in place for 2023. And as I have said many times before, I am not a Dennis Allen fan. But I am realistic enough to know that he wasn't going anywhere after one year and no amount of writhing in agony is going to change that fact.

Next is Pete Carmichael. I have been a critic of Carmichael pretty much all season long, but I'm getting the feeling his job may be safe, as well.

I would have liked to see Curry get a shot at OC, but unless Carmichael is replaced I have a feeling Curry will be getting that OC position elsewhere.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

We're in trouble. PERIOD.

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How else would Mr. Negativity feel? Don't worry, maybe the sun won't come up tomorrow. :D ;)

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Let me gently guide you back to the title of this thread. There.
The sun will come up tomorrow, and we'll still be in trouble.

It's not me being Mr. Negativity. It's the sorry-azz mismanagement of my team, after a pathetic season, that I am evaluating.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Back in the Jim Mora era, it was widely assumed the conservative/crappy play calling was because of Carl Smith. Many years later it was leaked by several ex players it was Jim Mora calling the shots the entire time and that Carl Smith was only doing what he was told to do. The point of this is on the surface we can all assume it's Pete Carmichael's fault, but it really could be the plays that the Dennis Allen is wanting called.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Sorry, I seem to have missed your evaluation.

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Clearly. Just re-read my first comment, without the "Kumbaya" sedative.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Possibly, although I'll give Mora a pass for leading us to our first five winning seasons in his first seven years as head coach. And first four playoff appearances. Hopefully we see at least the same from Allen moving forward.

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Looking at a list of "one and done" head coaches throughout history, the fact that D.A. isn't on that list right now, should surprise those who have faith in the mismanagement of this organization. It doesn't surprise those of us who don't.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

And Jim Mora had a personality.

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I still don't believe we have not made one coaching change. Sometimes I'm surprised at The Audacity Of This front office.

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And some playoff teams have already fired their OC, yet Pete is still walking around employed in New Orleans.

Brace yourself, 2023 could be rough.

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I'd rather be positive and look for us to easily win the division and make a run in the playoffs. It can't be any rougher than this past season and we finished literally one win out of the playoffs.

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"Playoffs?!?!? Playoffs?!?!? You kiddin me?!?!?"

~ Jim Mora

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Nope. Not kidding. You slip into the dance and you at least have a chance to take home the prom queen.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Back to the topic ...

As for both Nielsen and Richard, I'd miss them more for their individual position duties than as the co-DC's. Dennis Allen was running that defense and is the primary reason it is still elite. He's still doing all of the defensive playcalling and I wouldn't expect that to change. Their spots can be filled if we lose either or both without too much adversity.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

That was only because every team in our division sucked on the same level.

They can't be content with nearly making the playoffs, because the fact of the matter is some very shocking teams beat us.

If they fall into that "we nearly made the playoffs so let's not change anything" then it's going to be rough year after rough year.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

I've been doing more thinking about Carmichael. He was intricately involved in the play design phase for the last decade and a half. Sure, it's easier to design plays when it's Brees out there to execute them, but I doubt he's forgotten everything about that aspect of the job. I see his problem this past season as being far too conservative in the actual playcalling. Looking back over the years there have been occasions where he had those duties for one reason or another and was surprisingly aggressive and quite effective in making his calls.

What has changed? Is it perhaps the responsibility is too large? Is he concerned about screwing up? Did he not trust the QB's or the line? Did Allen, as was mentioned earlier, tell him to be conservative?

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

We couldn't beat Sam Darnold on even his worst day, to close out our wretched season AT HOME, and we don't shake the tree, while other teams are making changes, and we're in for a rough ride. We aren't even dressing to meet any prom queen at this point.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

I get that. How about changing the QB? That is the single most impactful position on the team. Let's address that. How about changing the playcalling? I addressed that a few minutes ago.

The defense was one of the best in the league, especially down the stretch. That's not easy when your offense is constantly going three and out. If we can get the offense even respectable we can be dangerous again.

I do not believe we are far away. A few less key players sitting on IR or on the bench would help, as well.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

:rolleyes:

https://media0.giphy.com/media/LbfT5qdS9m1zy/giphy.gif

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

You're good at rolling your eyes. Must be from all that practice on those silent 5 hour drives home from the dome this year. Brace yourself, next season looks to be a real knee-slapper. That could be dangerous while driving.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

*Looking up at the title of the thread*

:rolleyes:

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Only one team in our division sucked at the same level, or a bit worse than us. The other two teams actually sucked less than us, and beat us TWICE.

We DO fall into that "we nearly made the playoffs so let's not change anything", right after the "this team needs to lose to that team and then another team needs to lose to another team, to give us a chance of limping into the playoffs" period of our season - - - and some are ALREADY making excuses for what could be another really rough year (maybe years) ahead. Fascinating.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Personally I'm not expecting another rough year ahead. Looking forward to success next year.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

"Evaluating Coaches" = "Just keep doing what you're doing" = Rough Year(s) Ahead.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Who said keep doing what you're doing? We don't know who all our coaches are yet. We don't know our QB yet. We don't know what adjustments are going to be made. Chill out, dude. You are so full of gloom and doom.

I'm saying make changes to fix this past year. Open up the offense. Make adjustments.

:beer:

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Who said "keep doing what you're doing"? Dennis Allen. That didn't age well.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

When did he say that exactly and in what context?


I'm waiting.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

He said that way back when you were believing that he might coach us to a winning season. You're still waiting. "Just keep doing what you're doing".

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Nope. You keep claiming he said that. Show me the exact quote where he said it or you are just making it up to serve your narrative. "way back when" don't cut it. If he actually said it, it will be somewhere online. Prove it.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

In fact, if you can show me Dennis Allen's actual quote where he said that I will apologize to you for my ignorance and join your crusade to expel him from New Orleans.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Have you been an English Teacher before?

Just everytime anyone other than yourself posts something, you request proof like we are rewriting Shakespeare or something.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

"Gotta look at the tape" :rolleyes:. May take a few months or so.

Honestly Sinner, I don't think it matters WHO the HC is this year. The Saints had a borderline HOF HC & it didn't matter.

Until personnel improves at key positions, we are in trouble in spite of our Head Coach. We'll have a lame-duck coach ... whether it's DA or someone else. And then, we have highly compensated players who can't stay healthy.

Small observation - have you noticed how FIRST-YEAR HC Brian Daboll brought(Giants) Daniel Jones to the playoff & defeated a much more talented team? No one can tell me that if you gave him the Saints roster he's not doing at least the same, if not more.

Again, 2023 could be rough for New Orleans.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Oct 20, 2022 — “Nothing, just keep doing what’s he doing, you know?” Allen responded after watching his quarterback throw three interceptions in a single half of football. He thought for a moment, then added to his message: “Compete. Come out here and fight and that’s what we’re going to do.” And we LOST to the Cardinals.

Oct 21, 2022 — "We've just got to get back to doing what we do, knowing how to do it, and not beating ourselves."

Jan 8, 2023 - - - Sam Darnold showed us how to not beat ourselves AT THE DOME, by throwing for 43 total yards, ZERO touchdowns, and 2 interceptions and beating us.

Jan 18, 2023 - - - - Guido is still drinking the Kool Aid

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Nope. But Sinner has been claiming Dennis Allen told the team to "Just keep doing what you're doing" repeatedly, supposedly using it as a reason to get rid of him. If that is the basis for why he hates Allen so much I feel it should be easy for him to show me that reference. If he has actually been telling his team to do this then I would agree.

But, no, not an English Teacher, but I did spend a good deal of time in the news and sports reporting field and you do not publish (ie. post online) accusations without proof. I'm just asking fort that proof.

Re: Evaluating Coaches
 

Yup. Just as I thought. You are referring to that one instance where he told his QB to just keep doing what he's doing after the three interceptions. I have pointed that one out myself. Any good coach would tell his player to do just that at that point.

At no point did he ever tell his team to "Just keep doing what you're doing" as you have been claiming.

All that said, once again, I repeat, I am no particular fan of Dennis Allen, but I'm not making **** up to discredit the man.