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Stallworth Trade?

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; The value chart is for deals concerning players in the future. For players that have been around, their performance is what determines their value, regardless of what spot they were drafted in. By that reasoning you would expect more for ...

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Old 08-29-2006, 07:45 AM   #51
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The value chart is for deals concerning players in the future. For players that have been around, their performance is what determines their value, regardless of what spot they were drafted in. By that reasoning you would expect more for Ernie Conwell than Antonio Gates. The market value is what you can get. As long as he has been rumored on the block I do not doubt they took the best deal available. I liked him overall, but I do think he is closer to the 1st rd disappointment of Lelie that cost backup running back Duckett than the 2nd pick former AllPro Walker garnered.

His numbers may go up too. From Brooks to a solid QB most would. I think you'll still see the bobbling and drops though. Some receivers have incredible tools of size or speed but are lacking in that most essential element.

With it looking like a keepable WR or two was going to be cut I think it was a wise roster management move. As quoted, it was about the draft pick. Simoneau is lagniappe. At 29 I don't count him as quite ancient yet. He did have 100 tackles just two years ago. Just like Shanle, maybe not an AllPro but certainly an upgrade from the days of Hodge starting. LB isn't a team strength yet. It is nice to hear people point to other areas as the biggest hole for a change. That's progress. Or at least as some have noticed, the FO is no longer just sitting on their butts and keep losing the same way. That was a major beef with Haz... How far did we have to go down before Brooks was pulled? The LBs were NEVER properly addressed. How many of the same great athlete/poor football players did we keep accumulating? The presnap penalties increased from year to year. Etc, etc, etc. If you are gonna go 8-8 virtually 4 straight years at least shake it up and don't keep failing the same way.

Rant done.
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Old 08-29-2006, 07:52 AM   #52
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a mid grade lb for stall and nothing for d. smith.......should have packaged them together and got something good
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Old 08-29-2006, 07:55 AM   #53
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we all knew it would happen. i do not have the link but a Horn statement went something like this:
I lost two good friends from the team today.....With Donte I take some of the blame upon myself. I should of taught him to be more professional. If he was he would still be here.
That sums it up in a nut shell. It was not so much skills as attitude.
now a 4 that could be a 3 is a good deal. heck McNair only got a 4. The addition of a seasoned vet that can play and has played all 3 LB positions, as a starter, is a great throw in. Fast and covers in space very well is a big addition. He is a special teams demon, and has kicked a PAT or two to boot. The salaries are probly part of the reason he was added and the conditional pick accepted. he has 2 years left that pay him 1.1 and .95 million
So long donte and the best of luck. remeber once a saint always saint.
The bet is still on with some people here on dontes 06 performance. i still would like to loss the bet but he will drop enough passes to be a NFL lead leader. Once again keeping him from being among the elites of the game if his hammie does not go again. a shame
now I am worried if my boy hass will make it. well KC will show alot now that donte's sales auddition is over.
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Old 08-29-2006, 08:42 AM   #54
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http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2564338

From this story Joe Horn seems to indicate that Sall was being a butthead. I think Payton has made it clear that regardless of talent if you demonstate your ablity to be an ass your history.

And on a team where ablity is as rare as winning that is saying something!
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Old 08-29-2006, 08:51 AM   #55
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hagan, Henderson is next to audition! Payton is hell bent on starting with a "new lease on life" with the Saints. IMHO

I know it is heresy to say this around here, but Horn's days are numbered as well. Not this year, but watch out NEXT!
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Old 08-29-2006, 08:51 AM   #56
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It's simple. Stallworth is a gameday only player, and not a practice guy. But his history has been hit or miss and we have a Parcells type person at the helm, no nonsense, so that's it. Cry babies and loosers, big mouths and big shots will have a hard time here. Can you blame them? Only a select few hot shots actually cut checks their butts can pay for. I think he went for too little but I think we need LB help so bad they will deal anything.
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Old 08-29-2006, 09:21 AM   #57
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the Joe quote-

“I felt a little bad about Donte being traded because I felt it was a little my fault I didn’t instill more professionalism in him,� Horn said. “If they thought he had more professionalism, he’d still be here now.�

http://www.shreveporttimes.com/apps/...608290314/1001
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Old 08-29-2006, 11:16 AM   #58
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Ok I can get over losing Stallworth... but give me something for him. A LB who will have little to no impact and a conditional 4th rounder??? I just as soon as kept him a year. We have got to get big dominating people up on the lines and Mark isn't one of them. Its going to be a long 2-3 years.
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Old 08-29-2006, 11:47 AM   #59
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The site was down yesterday so I might be a little late in this discussion. I was very sad when I heard that we had traded Donte. I was always a big fan and thought that he solidified our receiving corps as being "legit." But then I got to thinking about how good he actually was. We all expected him to live up to his first-round status, but in reality, he never did. The guy was given pretty much every chance in the world, including the #1 spot for last season, and he still couldn't break the 1000 yard plateau. You can call it Brooks' fault or whatever you want, but I don't think Brooks ever kept Donte from being an upper echelon receiver; Donte did. He seems to have a serious lack of concentration or something. He does drop a lot of balls, plain and simple. We can sit here and let his athleticism overshadow the deficencies in his game, but that would just be silly. That's one of the good things about having a guy like Payton come in, a guy who has no emotional ties to the players yet. He can't play favorites and just keep the guy around because he drafted him, or he liked him, or whatever. And you know what, no matter how fast and how much I potential I though Donte had, he just wasn't very good. He's too inconsistent to be an upper echelon receiver. I thought maybe this year would be different, but then I saw him drop two perfectly placed balls in a row in the Colts game. Let's just admit defeat and say we made another mistake in the draft. But in reality, let's take a hard look at what we're losing here. Really, we're losing a #2 receiver. But he'll probably assume the role of #1 receiver in the Philly offense. In his only year as a #1 starter, he only 945 yards, and 7 touchdowns. For a #1 receiver that's not very good. For all of those other seasons when we had Joe Horn starting, and Stall as the #2 guy, he never had more than 60 catches, never more than 800 yards, and never double-digit touchdowns. No matter how much talent he has, his stats tell the picture: he's just not that good. His yardage numbers aren't even as good as Ashley Lelie (although Lelie never scored as many touchdowns). Anyways, I guess my point is that we're losing a guy that I'm sure a lot of people here were still hoping would "develop" into being worthy of a first-round pick, including myself, but let's face it, he's been in the league for five seasons, and he still hasn't shown that he's capable of it. I think that tells us that he's just not that good.

About the rest of the deal. Mark Simoneau? I guess we could have done worse. He had a monster season two or three seasons ago when he had like 149 tackles. Apparently not a run stuffer up the middle, but good at playing the run off the edges. I am glad that we got somebody out of this deal, and the 4th round pick makes me even happier. However, it does seem to me that we're just stockpiling mediocre LBs like we stockpiled mediocre safeties earlier in the preseason. I mean we can only put three out on the field during a game, so I don't think it helps to have like 20 on the roster. Oh well. Simoneau should be a good locker room influence and I think he can still make some plays, surely more than Colby Bockwoldt and most of our other LBs.

What about our receiving corps? WIthout Donte we now have Joe Horn and then I guess Marques and Jammal Jones or Hass. That's not as scary, but I see big things in Colston's future. Remember gentlemen, this guy is a rookie coming out of a division 1-AA school. He has shown he can play and this is very early in his process of getting acclimated to a much higher level of competition.
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Old 08-29-2006, 11:55 AM   #60
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Too many players in the league only play for their contract and not for the game.

Their goals are to hit that elevator clause, or trigger that bonus, not to win a SB. I think Stall is one of those players. The logic being that since he's on a bad team, he'll play for his bank account.

But, if Payton IS pulling in high character guys, at least they won't give up at the end of the season when things get dark. Hopefully their "character" will keep them fighting to the end and these new guys will make it interesting.

BTW, Charles Grant only plays for his contract too...
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