Offensive Line (educational)

WHODATINCA · 12-17-2013, 01:59 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

Yes and no..... Most fans watch the ball and are relatively clueless as to who misses some blocks in the running game.

Familiar with a "trap block"?

For the sake of this discussion both sides are the same as in Right side o-line is over Right side d-line.

Right Side DT crushes TB...... 98% of fans blame RT.

The trap block means it was actually the LGs responsibility to block the RDT. Notice the black line crossing in front of the Center.

With me so far? Yes you are.

Now....... The complicated nuances of the offensive line. The Center comes off the ball and gets jammed at the line.

When the LG pulls it's fast.... Very fast. Ball snapped, pivot right explode fast. He has to get to that RDT before that RB hits the hole.

But chit... He pivoted ad exploded into the side of the Center because he didn't get out if the way, never made it to the RDT, and the RB was crushed at the line of scrimmage.

Right tackle gets blamed or Right guard gets blamed
The Left Guard missed the block
It was all the Centers fault.

If you are with me to this point you'll understand some of my past comments about the offensive line being more about how the group plays together than how good each of them are individually. It's synchronized swimming with 1600 pounds of beast. It's the 100 empty coke cans that hold up the man because they all pull their weight evenly.

I'm with you. That was really helpful and instructive, Oak. I see your point. Thank you.

===========================================

Not sure if you saw this question: "Drew Brees average time to sack 3.63s only 2 QBS have shorter times Brady and Manning"

Yep. That does blow my mind. Where did you get that from? What this suggests is that with a great QB, you don't have to have an amazing O-line. Is that what this stat suggests?

TheOak · 12-17-2013, 07:43 AM

Originally Posted by WHODATINCA

I'm with you. That was really helpful and instructive, Oak. I see your point. Thank you.

===========================================

Not sure if you saw this question: "Drew Brees average time to sack 3.63s only 2 QBS have shorter times Brady and Manning"

Yep. That does blow my mind. Where did you get that from? What this suggests is that with a great QB, you don't have to have an amazing O-line. Is that what this stat suggests?

The Internetz must have eaten my previous reply.

I honestly think that stat has nothing to do with
the line per say but it does speak to two things.

1. They all get rid of the ball very quickly and their receivers run regimented routs.

2. None of the three are exactly fleet footed. Drew can scramble and run but doesn't, Brady and Manning remind me more of new born baby giraffes than scrambling QBs.

"If" and I say "if" because it is a huge part of this statement... If the receivers are able to run their routs as they are supposed to; not getting held up at the line, and being on step... all the o-line has to do is get in the way of defenders. Some QBs throw to an open receiver, some throw to an x on the field. Go back and watch 2009 and 2010, you will see what I mean... Now come to 2013, who has the highest % of receptions made (percentage of times thrown to that a reception was made)? Kenny Stills he runs tight routes and has not lost a step.

I know I am going to get roasted for this but its my gut feeling based on what I see from our receiving corps. Meachem, Moore, Colston are getting into their 6th, 7th, and 8th seasons and they are not as healthy or fast as they were in 2009/2010. One could say I have no clue but when you look at what was brought in this year you see clones of them. Stills/Moore, Toon/Colston Toon's hands are crap, Meachem/Hendersons replacement is Morgan but he cant stay healthy.

WHODATINCA · 12-18-2013, 02:46 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

The Internetz must have eaten my previous reply.

I know I am going to get roasted for this but its my gut feeling based on what I see from our receiving corps. Meachem, Moore, Colston are getting into their 6th, 7th, and 8th seasons and they are not as healthy or fast as they were in 2009/2010. One could say I have no clue but when you look at what was brought in this year you see clones of them. Stills/Moore, Toon/Colston Toon's hands are crap, Meachem/Hendersons replacement is Morgan but he cant stay healthy.

You aren't gonna get roasted by me. I'm seeing the same thing. Receivers slow off the line -- not getting to the ball. Maybe that's why we see Drew throwing it short.

12-17-2013, 01:59 AM	#1
WHODATINCA Site Donor Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: South Bay Posts: 3,784	Re: Offensive Line (educational) Originally Posted by TheOak Yes and no..... Most fans watch the ball and are relatively clueless as to who misses some blocks in the running game. Familiar with a "trap block"? For the sake of this discussion both sides are the same as in Right side o-line is over Right side d-line. Right Side DT crushes TB...... 98% of fans blame RT. The trap block means it was actually the LGs responsibility to block the RDT. Notice the black line crossing in front of the Center. With me so far? Yes you are. Now....... The complicated nuances of the offensive line. The Center comes off the ball and gets jammed at the line. When the LG pulls it's fast.... Very fast. Ball snapped, pivot right explode fast. He has to get to that RDT before that RB hits the hole. But chit... He pivoted ad exploded into the side of the Center because he didn't get out if the way, never made it to the RDT, and the RB was crushed at the line of scrimmage. Right tackle gets blamed or Right guard gets blamed The Left Guard missed the block It was all the Centers fault. If you are with me to this point you'll understand some of my past comments about the offensive line being more about how the group plays together than how good each of them are individually. It's synchronized swimming with 1600 pounds of beast. It's the 100 empty coke cans that hold up the man because they all pull their weight evenly. I'm with you. That was really helpful and instructive, Oak. I see your point. Thank you. =========================================== Not sure if you saw this question: "Drew Brees average time to sack 3.63s only 2 QBS have shorter times Brady and Manning" Yep. That does blow my mind. Where did you get that from? What this suggests is that with a great QB, you don't have to have an amazing O-line. Is that what this stat suggests?

12-17-2013, 07:43 AM	#2
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,043	Re: Offensive Line (educational) Originally Posted by WHODATINCA I'm with you. That was really helpful and instructive, Oak. I see your point. Thank you. =========================================== Not sure if you saw this question: "Drew Brees average time to sack 3.63s only 2 QBS have shorter times Brady and Manning" Yep. That does blow my mind. Where did you get that from? What this suggests is that with a great QB, you don't have to have an amazing O-line. Is that what this stat suggests? The Internetz must have eaten my previous reply. I honestly think that stat has nothing to do with the line per say but it does speak to two things. 1. They all get rid of the ball very quickly and their receivers run regimented routs. 2. None of the three are exactly fleet footed. Drew can scramble and run but doesn't, Brady and Manning remind me more of new born baby giraffes than scrambling QBs. "If" and I say "if" because it is a huge part of this statement... If the receivers are able to run their routs as they are supposed to; not getting held up at the line, and being on step... all the o-line has to do is get in the way of defenders. Some QBs throw to an open receiver, some throw to an x on the field. Go back and watch 2009 and 2010, you will see what I mean... Now come to 2013, who has the highest % of receptions made (percentage of times thrown to that a reception was made)? Kenny Stills he runs tight routes and has not lost a step. I know I am going to get roasted for this but its my gut feeling based on what I see from our receiving corps. Meachem, Moore, Colston are getting into their 6th, 7th, and 8th seasons and they are not as healthy or fast as they were in 2009/2010. One could say I have no clue but when you look at what was brought in this year you see clones of them. Stills/Moore, Toon/Colston Toon's hands are crap, Meachem/Hendersons replacement is Morgan but he cant stay healthy.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

12-18-2013, 02:46 AM	#3
WHODATINCA Site Donor Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: South Bay Posts: 3,784	Re: Offensive Line (educational) Originally Posted by TheOak The Internetz must have eaten my previous reply. I know I am going to get roasted for this but its my gut feeling based on what I see from our receiving corps. Meachem, Moore, Colston are getting into their 6th, 7th, and 8th seasons and they are not as healthy or fast as they were in 2009/2010. One could say I have no clue but when you look at what was brought in this year you see clones of them. Stills/Moore, Toon/Colston Toon's hands are crap, Meachem/Hendersons replacement is Morgan but he cant stay healthy. You aren't gonna get roasted by me. I'm seeing the same thing. Receivers slow off the line -- not getting to the ball. Maybe that's why we see Drew throwing it short.

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