Jeremy Shockey

Euphoria · 05-04-2008, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by Champ Kind

The whole "the Giants won because Shockey wasn't playing" argument holds no water whatsoever. What if Bush were to get hurt next year, and we made it to the playoffs? Would you say that the reason we made it was because he wasn't playing? You can't say it. Well you can, but it makes no sense.

actually the phrasing should be "THE GIANTS DIDN'T NEED SHOCKEY TO WIN THE SB". Which the follow up question should be "WHY DO WE NEED HIM IN ORDER TO WIN A SB"?

SaintFanInATLHELL · 05-04-2008, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

actually the phrasing should be "THE GIANTS DIDN'T NEED SHOCKEY TO WIN THE SB". Which the follow up question should be "WHY DO WE NEED HIM IN ORDER TO WIN A SB"?

Correct on both counts.

Thanks.

SFIAH

RickyInKenner · 05-04-2008, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

It holds gallons of water. What proof do you need that we don't need him to win a SB? He didn't win it for NY. NY went on to win it without his crappy self-serving attitude. He wasn't even on the sidelines during the games.

Don't try and compare apples to oranges (SB or playoffs) but use the same situation if we win the SB without Bush you can easily say the same thing, whats wrong with that... it would be fact.

the lack of sense this post makes is ridiculous. its just...staggering how idiotic it is holmes.

it really makes no sense to me. honestly. if the colts go to the superbowl, and lets say marvin harrison is injured in the afc championship and can't play in the big game and the colts still win, you can't say "WELL THEY DIDNT NEED HIM SO HES USELESS". they happened to win without shockey. that doesnt mean they got better when he stopped playing.

in this scenario, maybe they did get a little better because shockey is a guy who plays with emotion and has an ego and there was no leader in the giants lockerroom to guide him on the right path, but thatll change if he comes to the big easy.

foreverfan · 05-04-2008, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

Correct on both counts.

Thanks.

SFIAH

I bet Reggie Bush and Drew Brees want Shockey because he would instantly make them both better. Figure it out for yourselves cause I'm tired of typing.

This only thing that is important is that Payton wants him. Now if we could get an all pro LB or DE for the same price that we may get an all pro offensive player, I think we would all go for it.

Hey SFIAH, I have some beach front property in AZ I'll trade you for your beach front property in Kansas. Comes with a great desert view.

ssmitty · 05-04-2008, 03:56 PM

now, it is said as in the beginning.......
payton wants shockey...........
what part do some not understand........?
the saints hard nose coach wants shockey........
he does add a new demension.....
will it help, hender, or even come to past?
all i know is that the saints offense for the most part was lethargic against better teams or better defenses....so, what does that say?
we need angles, players that can give us those angles......
yes, the giants defense stunned brady, but their offense did equally well. and if you did not watch the game, go back and do it. they came through when they had to. if payton really does want shockey, i'm all for it because he will make us better, no doubt......
and for those that don't think they talked a lot about it, well, i believe they have, and know where each other stands. actually, the balls always been in the giants hands, but if the saints want him, it will get done......

SaintFanInATLHELL · 05-04-2008, 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by foreverfan

I bet Reggie Bush and Drew Brees want Shockey because he would instantly make them both better. Figure it out for yourselves cause I'm tired of typing.

From a talent standpoint you may be right. But that's not what I'm arguing.

Say we could get Antonio Gates. ProBowl Tight End. Worked with Brees. All around good guy.

No problem.

Truth is that if Shockey was the team player that everyone else on the Saints are, then the Giants wouldn't be shopping the guy.

This only thing that is important is that Payton wants him. Now if we could get an all pro LB or DE for the same price that we may get an all pro offensive player, I think we would all go for it.

It's important that the guy fits. The Giants price is too high. Shockey's attitude is too risky. So even though Payton may want him, he ain't coming here.

Hey SFIAH, I have some beach front property in AZ I'll trade you for your beach front property in Kansas. Comes with a great desert view.

Glad you finally caught up.

SFIAH

CheramieIII · 05-04-2008, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

If you think that Shockey is going to be happy being traded and keeping his current contract, then I have some lovely beachfront property in Kansas that I'd like to put up for sale.

As for winning the SB, Shockey has been a Giant for many years. Yet the year they win the SB, he didn't play.

Care to explain?

SFIAH

Thanks SFIAH you beat me too the punch. Yes, they won a superbowl without Shockey and he damn sure didn't help them get there because he was hurt again and who cares if he made the probowl, what are his numbers and contribution to the team? A big mouth with a big contract and thats it.

RickyInKenner · 05-04-2008, 05:11 PM

Shockey won't have problems with the Saints.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 05-04-2008, 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by RickyInKenner

Shockey won't have problems with the Saints.

And this assessment is based exactly on what?

You have a guy that wants to leave the Superbowl champions.

You have a guy that complains that he's underutilized in an offense. He'll come to an offense where he's guaranteed to be underutilized.

You have a guy who is complaining about restructuring his contract after one year. ONE YEAR!

You have a guy that has thrown his own coach under a bus.

But yet in all he comes here and suddenly he'll be a choirboy.

Pray tell. Why?

SFIAH

iceshack149 · 05-04-2008, 06:18 PM

This only thing that is important is that Payton wants him. Now if we could get an all pro LB or DE for the same price that we may get an all pro offensive player, I think we would all go for it.

You're close. Why can't the Saints obtain some one like Antonio Pierce rather than Shockey? I don't know what either of them are "worth" but if the price is close to the same, give me more defense.

My point is that the Saints offense aint broke so don't fix it. The defense has been broken for years and the Saints have done a great job in attempting to repair it this off season so either quit while you are ahead or bring in more competition on defense.

I think that the point to be made about Shockey and the Giants is that the Giants offense seemed to play better after Shockey was out for the rest of the 2007 season. I am included with the group that thinks that there is a correlation there.

05-04-2008, 02:51 PM	#21
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Re: payton wants shockey................... Originally Posted by Champ Kind The whole "the Giants won because Shockey wasn't playing" argument holds no water whatsoever. What if Bush were to get hurt next year, and we made it to the playoffs? Would you say that the reason we made it was because he wasn't playing? You can't say it. Well you can, but it makes no sense. actually the phrasing should be "THE GIANTS DIDN'T NEED SHOCKEY TO WIN THE SB". Which the follow up question should be "WHY DO WE NEED HIM IN ORDER TO WIN A SB"?

05-04-2008, 03:06 PM	#22
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,776	Re: payton wants shockey................... Originally Posted by Euphoria actually the phrasing should be "THE GIANTS DIDN'T NEED SHOCKEY TO WIN THE SB". Which the follow up question should be "WHY DO WE NEED HIM IN ORDER TO WIN A SB"? Correct on both counts. Thanks. SFIAH

05-04-2008, 03:13 PM	#23
RickyInKenner Registered Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 60	Re: payton wants shockey................... Originally Posted by Euphoria It holds gallons of water. What proof do you need that we don't need him to win a SB? He didn't win it for NY. NY went on to win it without his crappy self-serving attitude. He wasn't even on the sidelines during the games. Don't try and compare apples to oranges (SB or playoffs) but use the same situation if we win the SB without Bush you can easily say the same thing, whats wrong with that... it would be fact. the lack of sense this post makes is ridiculous. its just...staggering how idiotic it is holmes. it really makes no sense to me. honestly. if the colts go to the superbowl, and lets say marvin harrison is injured in the afc championship and can't play in the big game and the colts still win, you can't say "WELL THEY DIDNT NEED HIM SO HES USELESS". they happened to win without shockey. that doesnt mean they got better when he stopped playing. in this scenario, maybe they did get a little better because shockey is a guy who plays with emotion and has an ego and there was no leader in the giants lockerroom to guide him on the right path, but thatll change if he comes to the big easy.
RickyInKenner Registered Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 60

05-04-2008, 03:21 PM	#24
foreverfan 12,000 BS Posts Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Metairie, LA Posts: 13,457 Blog Entries: 5	Re: payton wants shockey................... Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL Correct on both counts. Thanks. SFIAH I bet Reggie Bush and Drew Brees want Shockey because he would instantly make them both better. Figure it out for yourselves cause I'm tired of typing. This only thing that is important is that Payton wants him. Now if we could get an all pro LB or DE for the same price that we may get an all pro offensive player, I think we would all go for it. Hey SFIAH, I have some beach front property in AZ I'll trade you for your beach front property in Kansas. Comes with a great desert view.

05-04-2008, 03:56 PM	#25
ssmitty 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 1,879	Re: payton wants shockey................... now, it is said as in the beginning....... payton wants shockey........... what part do some not understand........? the saints hard nose coach wants shockey........ he does add a new demension..... will it help, hender, or even come to past? all i know is that the saints offense for the most part was lethargic against better teams or better defenses....so, what does that say? we need angles, players that can give us those angles...... yes, the giants defense stunned brady, but their offense did equally well. and if you did not watch the game, go back and do it. they came through when they had to. if payton really does want shockey, i'm all for it because he will make us better, no doubt...... and for those that don't think they talked a lot about it, well, i believe they have, and know where each other stands. actually, the balls always been in the giants hands, but if the saints want him, it will get done......
ssmitty 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 1,879

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05-04-2008, 04:32 PM	#26
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,776	Re: payton wants shockey................... Originally Posted by foreverfan I bet Reggie Bush and Drew Brees want Shockey because he would instantly make them both better. Figure it out for yourselves cause I'm tired of typing. From a talent standpoint you may be right. But that's not what I'm arguing. Say we could get Antonio Gates. ProBowl Tight End. Worked with Brees. All around good guy. No problem. Truth is that if Shockey was the team player that everyone else on the Saints are, then the Giants wouldn't be shopping the guy. This only thing that is important is that Payton wants him. Now if we could get an all pro LB or DE for the same price that we may get an all pro offensive player, I think we would all go for it. It's important that the guy fits. The Giants price is too high. Shockey's attitude is too risky. So even though Payton may want him, he ain't coming here. Hey SFIAH, I have some beach front property in AZ I'll trade you for your beach front property in Kansas. Comes with a great desert view. Glad you finally caught up. SFIAH

05-04-2008, 04:54 PM	#27
CheramieIII Fan Since 1967 Join Date: May 2004 Location: Nomad Posts: 7,487 Blog Entries: 3	Re: payton wants shockey................... Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL If you think that Shockey is going to be happy being traded and keeping his current contract, then I have some lovely beachfront property in Kansas that I'd like to put up for sale. As for winning the SB, Shockey has been a Giant for many years. Yet the year they win the SB, he didn't play. Care to explain? SFIAH Thanks SFIAH you beat me too the punch. Yes, they won a superbowl without Shockey and he damn sure didn't help them get there because he was hurt again and who cares if he made the probowl, what are his numbers and contribution to the team? A big mouth with a big contract and thats it.

05-04-2008, 05:11 PM	#28
RickyInKenner Registered Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 60	Re: payton wants shockey................... Shockey won't have problems with the Saints.
RickyInKenner Registered Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 60

05-04-2008, 05:51 PM	#29
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,776	Re: payton wants shockey................... Originally Posted by RickyInKenner Shockey won't have problems with the Saints. And this assessment is based exactly on what? You have a guy that wants to leave the Superbowl champions. You have a guy that complains that he's underutilized in an offense. He'll come to an offense where he's guaranteed to be underutilized. You have a guy who is complaining about restructuring his contract after one year. ONE YEAR! You have a guy that has thrown his own coach under a bus. But yet in all he comes here and suddenly he'll be a choirboy. Pray tell. Why? SFIAH

05-04-2008, 06:18 PM	#30
iceshack149 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fairbanks, AK Posts: 4,299 Blog Entries: 1	Re: payton wants shockey................... This only thing that is important is that Payton wants him. Now if we could get an all pro LB or DE for the same price that we may get an all pro offensive player, I think we would all go for it. You're close. Why can't the Saints obtain some one like Antonio Pierce rather than Shockey? I don't know what either of them are "worth" but if the price is close to the same, give me more defense. My point is that the Saints offense aint broke so don't fix it. The defense has been broken for years and the Saints have done a great job in attempting to repair it this off season so either quit while you are ahead or bring in more competition on defense. I think that the point to be made about Shockey and the Giants is that the Giants offense seemed to play better after Shockey was out for the rest of the 2007 season. I am included with the group that thinks that there is a correlation there.
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