I'd like to try and get Derek Carr

leilung · 02-08-2023, 07:15 AM

Help me understand this.
Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one.

At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it?

Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South.

AsylumGuido · 02-08-2023, 07:25 AM

Originally Posted by leilung

Help me understand this.
Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one.

At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it?

Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South.

Forget about stats when comparing these two. Dalton had more to work with early in his career. Look at what each are capable of doing. Carr's passing has been compared to that of Matt Stafford's. He has the ability to make every throw in the route tree. Dalton is limited and simply cannot get the ball downfield. His intermediate range is even questionable. Carr also has better mobility. He's also a fiery leader on the field and in the clubhouse. That's something we have been missing since Brees left.

Carr's existing contract runs through 2025. Without adding any years we can easily convert his $32.9 million 2023 base salary into signing bonus and reduce his 2023 cap hit by around $20 million. If things work out we can then work out an extension to keep his cap hit at a reasonable level for the near future giving us the flexibility to keep adding pieces in the free agent market.

rezburna · 02-08-2023, 07:32 AM

Originally Posted by leilung

Help me understand this.
Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one.

At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it?

Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South.

The concerns are valid. Stats don’t always tell the tale though. I know for sure his completion percentage goes up here because of the style of our offense. I can’t even tell you who his #1 WR was with the Raiders over the course of his career and that offensive line has been pretty bad year in and year out.

AsylumGuido · 02-08-2023, 07:38 AM

Originally Posted by rezburna

The concerns are valid. Stats don’t always tell the tale though. I know for sure his completion percentage goes up here because of the style of our offense. I can’t even tell you who his #1 WR was with the Raiders over the course of his career and that offensive line has been pretty bad year in and year out.

Exatly. Dalton had a solid team around him through the earlier portions of his career. That's going to inflated his number. All you have to do is watch them each on the field today to tell that Dalton has no where near the arm talent as does Carr.

papz · 02-08-2023, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by leilung

Help me understand this.
Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one.

At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it?

Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South.

Good points. That said, if the price is right, I wouldn't mind taking a flier. I certainly wouldn't want to spend a lot of draft capital and pay him a bloated salary. Hopefully we don't try to bid against ourselves here. I don't have a lot of faith in the front office right now.

02-08-2023, 07:15 AM	#1
leilung Booty Bandit Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: The Wastelands that are NJ Posts: 1,422	Re: I'd like to try and get Derek Carr Help me understand this. Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one. At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it? Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South. jnormand, papz and K Major like this.
	A wise man once said, "Poo-poo smells just as bad as s#!%. One just SOUNDS cuter!"

02-08-2023, 07:25 AM	#2
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,574	Re: I'd like to try and get Derek Carr Originally Posted by leilung Help me understand this. Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one. At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it? Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South. Forget about stats when comparing these two. Dalton had more to work with early in his career. Look at what each are capable of doing. Carr's passing has been compared to that of Matt Stafford's. He has the ability to make every throw in the route tree. Dalton is limited and simply cannot get the ball downfield. His intermediate range is even questionable. Carr also has better mobility. He's also a fiery leader on the field and in the clubhouse. That's something we have been missing since Brees left. Carr's existing contract runs through 2025. Without adding any years we can easily convert his $32.9 million 2023 base salary into signing bonus and reduce his 2023 cap hit by around $20 million. If things work out we can then work out an extension to keep his cap hit at a reasonable level for the near future giving us the flexibility to keep adding pieces in the free agent market.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

02-08-2023, 07:32 AM	#3
rezburna 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Kenner, LA Posts: 8,022	Re: I'd like to try and get Derek Carr Originally Posted by leilung Help me understand this. Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one. At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it? Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South. The concerns are valid. Stats don’t always tell the tale though. I know for sure his completion percentage goes up here because of the style of our offense. I can’t even tell you who his #1 WR was with the Raiders over the course of his career and that offensive line has been pretty bad year in and year out. AsylumGuido and SmashMouth like this.

02-08-2023, 07:38 AM	#4
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,574	Re: I'd like to try and get Derek Carr Originally Posted by rezburna The concerns are valid. Stats don’t always tell the tale though. I know for sure his completion percentage goes up here because of the style of our offense. I can’t even tell you who his #1 WR was with the Raiders over the course of his career and that offensive line has been pretty bad year in and year out. Exatly. Dalton had a solid team around him through the earlier portions of his career. That's going to inflated his number. All you have to do is watch them each on the field today to tell that Dalton has no where near the arm talent as does Carr.

02-08-2023, 09:36 AM	#5
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,774	Re: I'd like to try and get Derek Carr Originally Posted by leilung Help me understand this. Some of us want Carr because he's a significant "upgrade" at QB? Have you taken note of his career stats vs. Dalton's? There is a few areas where he has better numbers, but they aren't anything that should Wow us. Given the fact that he has a pretty hefty pricetag, he's coming up on 32 years old (about 3 years younger than Dalton), and that he really hasn't proven much upside in his career, I would take a hard pass on this one. At the least, the team will be saddled with yet another $35+ million in salary plus draft picks, effectively stalling any chance of retaining or bringing in new talent for the foreseeable future. Combine that with the fact that we STILL have not shown any committment to moving on with a new OC, why do it? Can't see this move getting us deep into the playoffs, not even with a VERY bad Dirty South. Good points. That said, if the price is right, I wouldn't mind taking a flier. I certainly wouldn't want to spend a lot of draft capital and pay him a bloated salary. Hopefully we don't try to bid against ourselves here. I don't have a lot of faith in the front office right now. jnormand, neugey, leilung and 1 others like this.