Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Idk there wasn't much positive about the team last year. I'm not the type of person to sit there after the fourth straight loss to start the season and say "aw shucks, you boys put up a good fight, we'll get em next week. I'm proud of how hard you tried"
When the team is doing ****ty then there is a reason. You don't just ignore it and hope things will change. If discussing the things the team did wrong is negative and you are to fragile to take it then by all means step out.
Wasn't much positive to say about them last year. I guess the alternative is silence. If everyone thought that way then what would be the point of a discussion board.

I'm feeling better about the team. We will see tomorrow night.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Im as nervous as you are. maybe more.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I already pooped my pants and threw up all over the place.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

At this point though I would much rather see them go out there and **** the bed than endure one more agonizing day of no football.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Feel exactly the same way. Others feel we are still 7-9. 0-0 it is and starting a whole new season with a ton of new, improved pieces.

:bng:

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

That is certainly a glass mostly empty perspective. I view the situation from the incremental growth perspective. I'm the first to admit that there was not a direct translation to wins last year. But there was some encouraging signs. Let's establish the starting point. This is from July 2016:

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/2016-n...144938939.html
Some comparisons in 2016 to those numbers. Some (passing yards) were still bad (32nd in the league). But the 2015 squad gave up a NFL record 43 passing TD, while the 2016 squad only gave up 27 (20th in the league last year). The team finished 14th in rushing years as opposed to 31st the year before. The passer rating was down to 98.1, which is way too high, but down from the historic 116+ rating from the year before.

This shows incremental growth.

OTOH it's equally as frustrating to hear about how bad things were (are?) and to simply presume it's going to be more of the same in the upcoming season simply because that's how it's always been.

It's equally as frustrating because the changes that are being called for, specifically clearing out the front office and coaching staffs, blowing the whole team up, and starting over are both like never going to happen and is unlikely to improve the likely outcomes. If that strategy worked, then Cleveland for example would have a rack full of Lombardi's.

In short complaining about the problems is unproductive. I have the same issue with my brother, who as a season ticket holder wants the Saints offense to be a power running team. After the 58th time of explaining that model simply isn't in the Payton, Carmichael, Brees offensive DNA, it just gets a bit old to keep hearing the complaint.

BTW I saw the videos of the indoor short yardage sets from practice. The same plays such as halfback pitches to the outside and passes to the flat were prominently displayed. Those kind of plays just drives him nuts.

Actually I'm back with my annual call to temper expectations in the preseason. The best we can all do is to evaluate the fundamental play of the 1st and 2nd string squads. with a minimum of 6 starters out on both sides of the ball, there is virtually nothing that we can extrapolate from tonight that will translate to what happens when the flak starts flying for real in September.

So keep in mind that a month from now half of the Saints squad will be on the street and players who are not on even here may end up on the final 53.

Keep an eye on the fundamentals, especially on defense. Are they lined up right? Are they tackling properly? Are the linebackers flowing to the ball? Are receiver defenders disrupting routes, breaking up passes, and intercepting the ball when the opportunity is there? Does the defense (no matter who is out there) look like they are playing as a unit instead of looking like a scramble drill? Is the defensive line creating push, pressure, and hopefully sacks? Are special teams plays being executed properly?

Preseason is a time to gel and create an identity. If we can see those elements in the first two defensive teams then that incremental growth will hopefully reap benefits during the regular season and beyond.

SFIAH

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

When myself and my girl travelled to New Orleans in 2015, we caught the Saints vs Pats preseason game.
Long story short, Brees played incredibly. Then the 2nd and 3rd stringers blew a 21-3 lead, losing by 2 points in the end. That's what happened to us all regular season, losing by 3 points or less.

Preseason matters, I want to see desire and attitude.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Diz,
Where are you located?

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

You're spinning your wheels, my friend. Your very first sentence hits the nail on the head. I seriously doubt he took the time to read your response.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I'm in the UK, Major.

We travelled to New York and then New Orleans for my 24th birthday back in 2015.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I didn't know you were in UK

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Sometimes ladies and gents it only takes one drop to be a big deal!

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

In a real, meaningful game having to settle for FG's instead of TD's is a big deal Guido. No excuse for that drop & I'm sure coach Payton had a problem with that.

TG Jr is who he is though.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

My question is why is Ginn even in that package? From the 10? What benefit is burner speed when the farthest you can go is 20 yd?

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

And Ginn has a history of drops. Hoped coaching would help but he's an old dog.

There were improvements but at the end of the day it was a carbon copy of last4 years. Blow 3rd and impossible and screw the pooch 2 min offense.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Get use to Ted running wild open and hit in the bread basket with a perfect pass only to drop it.

He has a long history of butter fingers when running free and at the worse time.

I can remember the panthers vs saints in the dome, not once, not twice but at the very least 3 times he dropped long passes. He was wide open. Plays that would have put up 7 or put the kitties in range to put up points.

When he did it we cheered. This year we will be throwing bricks at the TV.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I'd much rather get used to showing him the door and keeping tommy

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I remember last year when we signed Fleener and everyone said it was a terrible contract and we'd be disappointed. Man we fought back and tried to dig up any little stat we could to show he didn't drop passes like people said. Then the season starts and there's a big wuss out there at TE not making catches in the crucial moments.

Get used to it with Ginn folks... This is who he is and it won't magically be solved just because he's in black and gold now.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

That's a good example because I was one of the dummies trying to be like I don't think he drops lots of passes....I feel like a fool

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Now we have Fleener and Ginn with stone hands and both are starters with Brees throwing to them, not to mention the D we have. Payton might have finally lost his mind. Hope this works out if not it's going to get ugly.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Can we at least cut Ginn and keep TLL? Cause Tommy is a baller

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Wishful thinking spike. I like Tommy also but Payton want cut Ginn because he brought him in.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Woohoo!!!

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I know...sad too

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

The cramps that sidelined him for multiple days must have went away

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

OJ Howard was my answer for Fleener and that god awful contract. I always look at the impact a drafted player has to our cap flexibility

Fleener Potential Out: 2018, 2 yr, $14,741,169; $4,800,000 dead cap thats 5 million in cap space we passed up in the next two years.


Then there is

Nick Fairley 4/$28 million
Tedd Ginn 3/$11 million

I still can think of better ways to spend that money

2 for 1
Johnathan Hankins 3/$30 million

or 3/2
Lawrence Guy 4/$13 million
Rex Burkhead 1/$3 million

and have 3+ million in cap space left

Duron Harmon signed a 4/$17 million

best laid plans of mice and men. :rolleyes:

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

That's what was saying. We already have Fleener. We don't need two. Lewis impresses the **** out of me

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

If we suck again this year Sean is on his way out. There's no excuses left. You're three years into rebuilding, how long does it take.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Well, the Bills are going on 17 years, the Browns are going on 14 years, the Rams are going on 12 years, the Jags and the Bucs are going on 9 years, Titans are going on 8 years...

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Especially when you accumulate dead money consistently...

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Exactly!!! Good hell guys, at least we're perennial bottom dwellers.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

So you're advocating for that?We have 4 of the last 5. How many do you enjoy if it doesn't stop this year?

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Exactly? I don't understand this logic bro. I really don't. Embrace the suck because it could be worse. At least we're mediocre each year and fairly average. Needs to end this year or he needs a new sideline to patrol.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I didn't advocate for anything. You asked how long rebuilding takes and I listed the some of the current playoff droughts.

But since you asked...In my mind, hiring a new head coach in the NFL is a hit or miss thing, and it seems to me, it misses more often than not. How many seasons do you give a new coach to turn things around? Two, three years? And if that coach doesn't work, how many years do you give the next guy? I'm more confident in Payton than I am in an unknown.

We've talked about it on here dozens of times this offseason how close some of those games were last year. 3 busted special teams plays from being 10-6 instead of 7-9. I don't know how long I'll be happy with losing seasons but the team is still competitive so I'm happy for now. Who knows though, if the Saints go 4-12 this season, losing by 20 every game or if it seems he's lost control of the team, I'll probably be on the "fire Payton" bandwagon, but for now, I'm not there yet.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Ghe difference between us and those teams such as Bucs, Titans, Jags, Browns etc is they do not have a HOF QB.

We have been completely incapable of giving our HOF QB any sort of defensive help.

On 2 occasions we have traded his best receiver and got pretty much zero positive results from it.

I'm already starting to think Lattimore was the wrong pick, we should have focused upfront and drafted Barnett or someone like that.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Yep! How many suck years have the Patties had? How many suck years did Indy have when Manning was there? we're rocking 7-9.

Bucs got a pretty good QB in the making down there and they nearly made the playoffs last year. Titans seemed to have a pretty good QB in the making, i think they'll fight for a spot too this year.

Tell you what is scary, 3 of this years drafts picks are hurt with one coming back to the lineup today. Our secondary was 50% down 10 days into camp. Did Rankins play in the Browns game? Never even heard his name called. Then you have to worry that his success last year came because Nick was eating double teams.

I feel we have more talent and the excuses for SP are over. This year is playoffs or bust.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

7-9 gets you the 11th pick in the draft, two years running I might add. Thats not competitive. It's not even average, that would be 16th pick.

Let's see what happens this season. I really am hoping for success because losing sucks anymore. 7-9 again and he needs pound pavement

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

I've got a feeling Lattimore is going to be out for months, I really hope not but he hasn't practiced or been seen since the injury.

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

yeah, did you see the video someone posted of how he landed on his knee?

Re: 2017 New Orleans Saints Training Camp
 

Yeah I saw it, didn't really know what to think but I'll never trust Payton when it comes to injuries.